Science and Research Committee on May 19th, 2022

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

I'd like to thank the witnesses who are joining us during the third hour of this meeting.

My first questions are for Ms. Amyot, of Colleges and Institutes Canada.

Ms. Amyot, what role do you believe CEGEPs and colleges are playing to attract and retain talent locally, particularly in rural communities?

[Denise Amyot]

That's a very good question.

Not long ago, Statistics Canada published data on women in rural communities. I'd be glad to send this information to you.

The data showed that women in rural communities are less likely to enter postsecondary education, and that when they do, it's mainly at the college level. That's important to us, because we are accessible; we are everywhere. As I mentioned, we have 700 campuses across Canada, with 95% of Canadians living less than 50 km away from one of our campuses, and 86% of indigenous people also within 50 km from one of our campuses.

When people study in their home region, they generally remain there to work afterwards. We train students in accordance with workforce requirements. That means that people will be able to work in their own community.

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Thank you very much, Ms. Amyot.

How would you describe the difference between talent developed at CEGEPs and talent developed at universities?

[Denise Amyot]

Our organization was established 52 years ago to serve communities across Canada, in accordance with labour market needs. Our organization is therefore very young.

When our organization was created, it was taken for granted that students placement would be within a six month period. It was also important to make sure that employers were involved in developing the program of studies and that students would be able to have internships.

For our organization, internships are definitely a requirement. In fact, the vast majority—98%—of our 10,000 programs make an internship mandatory for graduation.

Those are the major features of colleges.

Also, when we conduct research, we do so with due regard to the problems being faced by industry or non-government organizations. We help them find solutions to their problems. Moreover, the industries we collaborate with retain intellectual property on their work. That's what makes us so different from other institutions.

I'll stop there, given the short time remaining to me, but I could provide you with other examples.

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Thank you, Ms. Amyot.

What specific measures could be introduced to attract and retain more students to CEGEPs and colleges?

[Denise Amyot]

First of all, it would be important for things like international student study permits to be approved more quickly.

During the pandemic, less than half the normal number of study permits were approved. And yet, at the time we are talking about, we had 40% more applications than we had been receiving before the pandemic. In addition, the number of applications from students in Thailand, the Philippines and Vietnam, among others, doubled.

Sadly, we learned that there was a major backlog at the time in processing study permit applications. Many students usually arrive in the spring, but that was not the case this year owing to these backlogs. At the moment, 140,000 applications are awaiting processing. We can't have that many applications on hold if we want students to be able to come here and study in September.

It would also be important for students to have access to financial support so that they could continue their education and have paid internships. During the pandemic, there were fewer internships available. It was therefore more difficult for students to find one. However, the government took one positive step. It made postsecondary institutions eligible for the Federal Internship for Newcomers Program. This initiative greatly facilitated the internship process and was very helpful to postsecondary institutions.

Those are just a few examples to give you a better idea of our circumstances.

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Based on your experience, could you explain how CEGEPs, colleges and universities could work together to make the most of their respective expertise?

[Denise Amyot]

Do you mean in any field of study?

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Yes, that's right.

[Denise Amyot]

It would mean working closely together. When we develop programs, we do so in terms of community needs. We get industry involved in developing study programs and we work with the universities on applied research and other areas. That's interesting, because increasingly, students are coming...

[The Chair, Liberal, Kirsty Duncan]

Ms. Amyot, I apologize for interrupting.

It really is an awful part of this.

Thank you to you both.

[Denise Amyot]

I'll send Mr. Blanchette-Joncas some additional information about this.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kirsty Duncan]

Now we'll go to Mr. Bachrach for six minutes, please.

[Taylor Bachrach]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Ms. Amyot, I will stick with you for my first questions. I'm keen to pick up on a theme that we've heard a bit about this evening, which is the idea of the government focusing its investment in certain areas where there are unique challenges facing society and where it can maximize the value of its investment in innovation and applied research.

I noticed your SDG brooch and thought perhaps I would ask you specifically about the climate solution space and whether the federal government is currently investing in colleges and institutes and applied research in that space. What does that look like and what is the potential? What changes need to be made so that Canada is doing what it needs to do to invest in talent and applied research specifically in the climate solution space?

[Denise Amyot]

I will be pleased to share with you a report we have tabled with the government on net-zero climate so that you can see a number of aspects. It could be, for example, in training or applied research or in ensuring that the different entities, the different colleges across the country, can talk to each other, do even better and share best practices.

I have examples of projects that have been done on climate change and climate mitigation. I would be pleased to share those with you, but we could do way more. I gave you statistics with respect to the results we have obtained. Nobody else can say that for each dollar, they get another dollar.

I don't believe we should focus on only some aspects, because this country is big, and we need to ensure that we also look at what the specific needs are. For example, in the Atlantic, there may be needs with respect to the ocean and water management, but in the Prairies it may be something with respect to smart farming and net zero. We may have a big topic, but we need to take into consideration the different needs of the country to ensure that we serve all Canadians.

[Taylor Bachrach]

Thank you, Ms. Amyot.

Picking up on another theme we've talked a bit about, which is barriers to students who are seeking opportunities at institutions like the ones you represent, we talked about barriers faced by graduate and post-graduate researchers as a result of scholarships not keeping up with inflation. A lot of students live in poverty and have to obtain employment outside their field of research.

Speaking specifically about colleges and institutes, what are the barriers you see students facing as they come into your institutions?

[Denise Amyot]

Some of the barriers are with respect to mental health, definitely. It is a big issue. Some of the barriers are financial. We are often the first door for students at the college level, because they are the first ones to go to post-secondary education, or we are the last door because they have tried many others, and we need to have access to wraparound services. Our classes have only 30 people in them, but some of the students we have need a lot of support. They had support at the elementary and high school levels, but when they arrive at the post-secondary level, it's harder to get access to all those wraparound services.

One of the things we have observed in the last 15 years—and I have a great slide I will be pleased to share with you—is that at the post-secondary level, we have seen diminishing public funding across the country. This is a big barrier, because it means that we cannot offer all the services we should be able to offer to students. We need to ensure that we have a robust public education system in Canada.

[Taylor Bachrach]

Finally, Ms. Amyot, when it comes to diversity and inclusion, are you seeing that the students coming to the institutions you represent reflect the goals of diversity and inclusion? Do diverse populations have the supports they need? Is there something specific there around offering supports?

[Denise Amyot]

Yes, absolutely. Students who are diverse also need support from a mental health perspective. They have financial barriers also, so they are not different.

We have signed the 50-30 challenge that the Government of Canada has put forward. In fact, we were one of the first signatories. Now we have been given the task of sharing with the business sector the guide that will be produced by KPMG for the Government of Canada on EDI.

I'll just give you a statistic that is very interesting from a gender perspective. At the president level—and this gives you a very good indication—38% of the presidents in our system are women, so we're very pleased about that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kirsty Duncan]

Ms. Amyot—

[Denise Amyot]

Of course, we would prefer it to be 50%, but we're making progress.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kirsty Duncan]

Ms. Amyot, would you like to table those statistics with the committee?

[Denise Amyot]

Yes, absolutely.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kirsty Duncan]

Thank you so very much. I know people are tired. I hope these wonderful witnesses are bearing with us.

We're going to now go to a second round. It's a five-minute round, and we're going to go to Mr. Williams, please.

[Ryan Williams, Conservative, Bay of Quinte, ON]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair, and through you, I'll continue with Ms. Amyot.

To continue on the conversation, with only 2% of tri-agency funding, colleges have produced significant and rapid results to benefit communities and businesses across the country.

Can you specify how much more funding colleges need to build on this, and how these funds should be allocated between project support, operational support, etc.?