Evidence of meeting #48 for Science and Research in the 44th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was chair.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB
Thank you, Chair.
Thank you, Dr. Nemer, for coming here today.
Has the Prime Minister ever discussed increasing student scholarships with you?
Chief Science Advisor, Office of the Chief Science Advisor
Mr. Chair, those are the kinds of conversations that I have with the Minister of Science rather than with the Prime Minister. It's the minister's responsibility, I think, to then bring it to his cabinet colleagues and the Prime Minister.
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB
Have you ever discussed it with the minister?
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB
Okay, thank you.
Dr. Nemer, we know that the tri-council granting agencies receive significant funding from the federal government. In 2021-22, the Canadian Institutes of Health Research had a budget of $815.5 million in discretionary funding, which we learned could be reallocated to students on the front lines. Are you aware of any discussions with the tri-council agencies to find savings within their own budgets to reallocate to funding students?
Chief Science Advisor, Office of the Chief Science Advisor
Mr. Chair, I'm not aware of these internal conversations among the tri-council. They would have to answer this.
If I may, I would like to specify that the graduate students need to have an environment where they do their research, and they need to have support for that research. If they have the funding, but they don't have the means in terms of the tools and the material required, then they can't carry out their research project. There needs to be a balance in the system in terms of everything that's needed.
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB
Thank you.
Dr. Nemer, you spoke about future-proofing in your opening remarks. Are you aware that CSIS warned Canadian research institutions that Beijing is threatening Canada's national security and intellectual property in five sensitive areas of research and development?
Chief Science Advisor, Office of the Chief Science Advisor
Yes, I am aware.
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB
How seriously should elected officials take this issue of national security in Canadian research institutions?
Chief Science Advisor, Office of the Chief Science Advisor
Mr. Chair, the issue about safeguarding research is a very important one, and it has always existed. Spying and stealing intellectual property has always existed.
Other countries have been more interested in us because we've been so successful in so many important areas. I think we need to absolutely look at ways to support our researchers and our institutions to safeguard research, to protect our intellectual property and to make sure we can get the most out of it in our own country.
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB
Do you think elected officials could take this a little bit more seriously? Would you like to see more focus on that?
Chief Science Advisor, Office of the Chief Science Advisor
It's not my role to tell elected officials what to do.
Conservative
Dan Mazier Conservative Dauphin—Swan River—Neepawa, MB
That's okay, we can take it.
Dr. Nemer, from 2017 to 2022, the tri-council of Canadian granting agencies received an increase in funding. The Canadian Institutes of Health Research funding went from $1.1 billion to $1.4 billion. The National Sciences and Engineering Research Council of Canada funding went from $1.2 billion to $1.4 billion, and the Social Sciences of Humanities Research Council of Canada funding went from $784 million to $1 billion.
Despite all of this new spending, our committee has heard stories of students who have turned to food banks, who find themselves homeless, living in shelters as the cost of rent across this country has skyrocketed. We had students on strike here on Parliament Hill. They filled our committee room, which is good. I commend them for coming out and speaking up to let their voices be heard at this committee.
Why do you think this government is ignoring the voices of students?
Chief Science Advisor, Office of the Chief Science Advisor
Mr. Chair, first of all, I am very supportive of this committee's study, which is extremely timely and important for the country.
As I said, I can't speak for the government. The only thing I can say is that if it were an easy approach.... If we had only the scholarships that are paid directly to students, and we could deal with them, it would be one thing. I think it's the system that needs to be examined properly. There needs to be proper coordination and analysis to see whether there are efficiencies that can be gained. These multiple layers of scholarship programs, and so on.... I think it's the appropriate thing to do, to examine all this now.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Lloyd Longfield
Yes, that's great. Thank you.
I see the analysts typing away. I'm looking forward to seeing the testimony coming back to us. This is a terrific discussion.
Ms. Bradford, perhaps you'd like to continue the discussion for the next five minutes.
Liberal
Valerie Bradford Liberal Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Dr. Nemer, for coming back to our committee again today.
With respect to the equity, diversity and inclusion requirements and practices for Canada research chairs, how is the federal government supporting diversity and inclusion in the funding space, and what can we be doing better?
Chief Science Advisor, Office of the Chief Science Advisor
The issue of EDI is extremely important, and the federal government has taken some pretty significant steps in requiring institutions to reach the pre-established and agreed upon targets, so I think that has been an important development.
I think in terms of supporting EDI at the level of the chairs program, that's the end of the pipeline; that's the ultimate goal. We need to see whether earlier in the pipeline we are supporting EDI, whether during our undergraduate programs or our graduate programs, including scholarships. I think we need to have a holistic view of this. There are also areas that are more in need of attention than others are, so we also need to focus our efforts.
Liberal
Valerie Bradford Liberal Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON
Following on that, how does the government ensure equal opportunities for both male and female applicants in its scholarship and post-doctoral fellowship programs?
Chief Science Advisor, Office of the Chief Science Advisor
You know, I remember a long time ago when I wrote my application for the chair program, one needed basically to brag about their accomplishments, and bragging, with all due respect, does not come naturally to many women and many females. So sometimes just the way the applications are set up can have an undesirable effect in terms of the review of the applications and the material that is in front of the peer review committees for this. I think the gender lens needs to be taken into account throughout the process.
Liberal
Valerie Bradford Liberal Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON
Thank you for that.
Can you provide the committee with some insight into the role of the Canada Research Coordinating Committee in addressing systemic barriers in research faced by women and other marginalized groups?
Chief Science Advisor, Office of the Chief Science Advisor
You want me to comment on the CRCC efforts? I'm sorry but I didn't hear the beginning.
Liberal
Valerie Bradford Liberal Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON
Yes, it's on the Canada Research Coordinating Committee.
Chief Science Advisor, Office of the Chief Science Advisor
The Canada Research Coordinating Committee undertook basically to look at horizontal issues, and systemic discrimination and exclusion of certain communities was high on the list. The first thing was to get the data, because we didn't collect data systematically before, and to address it through the different programs, so it is a work in progress. I think the tri-agency presidents would probably be in a better position than I am to give you an update on this.
Liberal
Valerie Bradford Liberal Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON
Understood.
Mentorship and networking are so important in progressing through any career or any program. Are there any mentorship or networking opportunities provided to female scholars and post-doctoral fellows to enhance their professional growth and increase their chances of career success?