Status of Women Committee on June 22nd, 2006

[Helena Guergis, Conservative, Simcoe—Grey, ON]

Thank you.

This is a really good work plan, and I want to commend our researchers for taking the time to put this together.

I'm taking a look at the economic security of women. I'm always talking about income splitting, and that is what I will continue to push for around this table. At least on the first page, I note we have a majority of the pension organizations that were listed to talk about EI, OAS, and CPP. They were specific in wanting to speak only about income splitting when they made their requests, and the Association of Canadian Pension Management may want to come forward to speak about income splitting. To reiterate my comments, probably a minimum of two meetings should be designated to the economic security of women, and probably one other meeting focused entirely on understanding income splitting. From the questions I have asked of the small number of witnesses, they don't know what I'm talking about, or how they would answer, or have a position on what we're trying to talk about.

For us to fully understand it and then be able to put our questions, with the knowledge we will require to be able to do so, asking some of these groups prior to their coming in, giving them the information we've discovered, asking them to look at what we've discovered and what they have to say, and helping them form their arguments and their positions on income splitting might be a good strategy.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Thank you. That's very helpful.

Ms. Stronach, and that will be the last speaker. Then we'll need to recap where we're going.

[Belinda Stronach, Liberal, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

I'll be fast, as much has been said.

I'd also like to commend the analysts on the work plan. I think it's good, and if we had more time we could probably go through it all, but as the chair said, we want to have something completed by December.

I also think human trafficking is important, but we shouldn't waste the good work that's been done. We should pull that out. We should get an analysis of where it's at and then build on it very quickly so we can accomplish something. But I also think we must focus on economic security, because if women can attain economic freedom, then they have real choices, and that affects so many other areas, as well as trafficking and housing. The foundation has to be economic security. It always frustrates me when we lose sight of the good work that's been done. Regardless of which party brought it forward, we should take it, see what's good about it, and build on that.

I understand some very good work has been done on human trafficking, and suggestions have already been made as to where the work can be improved, so let's find out what that is, build on it, and get it done.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

I think the analyst is nodding as if she's gained enough....

If we were to come back in September, we could get the existing legislation and have those particular people speak directly to what's there. We had some suggestions that came out of committee on beefing up the existing piece of legislation and hearing from a couple of very pertinent witnesses to the issue to keep us very focused. We may decide at that time that we then need to make it much broader, because it's bigger than what we had.

A lot of work has already been done. Let's pull together what's been done in the existing legislation and have the appropriate officials give us a top-notch briefing on where we are. Is it growing? To what extent is it growing? What else can we do as a status of women committee to give some focus and bring that issue to a head? It encompasses an awful lot of other issues.

On the economic side of the issue, I think the financial independence of women is key. If women have financial independence, whether they're young or old, they won't find themselves in a variety of other situations, which we are constantly dealing with.

Ms. Smith.

[Joy Smith, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Madam Chair, human trafficking is not a political thing.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

No, not at all.

[Joy Smith, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

I do not want to negate leaving out the witnesses.

I agree that we need to pull everything together. I commend the former government's work on that. It's excellent, and we need to pull it together. But it doesn't mean that's the only thing we need to focus on.

I want to have witnesses here, because there are new things. We need to pull this together and make sure it really happens.

I agree with you. If we could have a half-and-half split, with income splitting as well, I would agree to that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

I think it's important that we make sure we know exactly what is going on and what else we can do to move it along.

We still have two motions on the floor, which were put here a week ago, that we need to deal with.

We'll quickly go to Ms. Mourani and Ms. Minna.

[Maria Mourani, Bloc, Ahuntsic, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I totally agree with Ms. Smith. I think we need to use the information that we already have as a starting point for our study. We shouldn't throw everything out and start over at the beginning, but we also need to hear about any new developments or progress made on this front.

Again, I maintain that we should also focus on solicitation in connection with the decriminalization or legalization of prostitution and human trafficking. It's critically important to examine this aspect of human trafficking.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

I'm sorry. Ms. Mathyssen has been trying to get a word in edgewise, and I hadn't noticed.

Are you okay, Ms. Mathyssen?

[Irene Mathyssen, NDP, London—Fanshawe, ON]

I actually want to have the floor for a moment.

I think much of what's been said is very important. I believe the economic security of women is the basis for a great deal of the violence and the problems that women face.

I would also like to speak to my motion.

I'm looking at the time. I realize how very limited it is and that 12 weeks isn't a great deal of time. In those 12 weeks, if we haven't talked about the basis of the problems that face women, I think we've missed an opportunity.

I would like to refer to my motion, as I said. I think the lack of representation of women in the legislatures and in Parliament is the basis for this—hence, my motion.

If you look at the literature, including the report “The War Against Women” and reports from CIDA, it cites the fact that women are underrepresented. If we can bring attention to that and make some definite gains in that regard, I think addressing some of the subsequent ills and misfortunes of women will begin to fall into place.

We have a forum. We have a voice for women in the places of power. The problem has been that women have not had representation in places of power.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

On the motions, Ms. Smith's motion on human trafficking hasn't officially been adopted.

[Joy Smith, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Can we quickly adopt it and go on to Ms. Mathyssen's motion?

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Yes. All right.

[Maria Minna, Liberal, Beaches—East York, ON]

There's already a motion to that effect, which I put forward before. Why do we need another one?

With respect, I won't play games with this issue. I think Madam Smith should withdraw her motion, if she wants to show some respect for her colleagues.

I already have a motion, which is why it's on the order paper. It's the motion addressing the issue of violence against women and it includes trafficking, which is why trafficking is part of our work. If we're doing the work already, why do we need another motion in addition to the motion that's already on the table as a result of our work?

I quite frankly find it offensive.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

The committee had already formally agreed at the beginning that we were going to include human trafficking--

[Maria Minna, Liberal, Beaches—East York, ON]

It was part of the motion I presented, Madam Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Yes, and it was already part of what we all agreed to do at the very beginning. So, effectively, it is unnecessary to table the motion. Thank you anyway, but it has already been agreed upon.

[Joy Smith, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

That's fine, as long as we have it on record.

[Maria Minna, Liberal, Beaches—East York, ON]

It's wasting people's time.

[Joy Smith, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Madam Chair, I'm not trying to offend Madam Minna. I just wanted it on the agenda. Sorry to have hurt your feelings.

[Maria Minna, Liberal, Beaches—East York, ON]

We worked on the motion, we passed it, it's part of our work.

[Joy Smith, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

I forgot.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

That's fine.

Regarding Ms. Mathyssen's motion, it's talking about initiating a study. Given the workload we have, it's a question of how we deal with that. Do we want to defer dealing with that motion until the fall, when we look at what we will have coming back on those other two issues, and see if there is an opportunity at that time to see if we can figure out how we might fit that into the process?

Ms. Neville.

[Anita Neville, Liberal, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

Thank you.

It's certainly a motion that I would think most of us have sympathy with, Madam Chair. I don't want to discuss it in two minutes, but I would appreciate if there are studies available that Ms. Mathyssen refers to here...or maybe you don't refer to them. But if the researchers could give us some information on what's being done in other countries that we could look at over the summer, then perhaps we could discuss this with some full information in the fall. I'd be prepared to deal with this motion at a very early meeting in the fall, because I think it is important to everybody here.