Status of Women Committee on Feb. 1st, 2007

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Members of the committee, I guess it's general practice that when we have witnesses we do the business of the committee after the witnesses are gone.

I'd like to welcome Minister Oda and Ms. Ievers. Thank you for being here.

The minister has advised me that she'll be speaking for about 10 minutes, which will give us an opportunity to question her. I hope you all have the speaking notes in front of you.

Without further ado, Minister, the floor is yours.

[Bev Oda, Conservative, Minister of Canadian Heritage and Status of Women]

Thank you very much. Good afternoon, Madam Chair and committee members. Thank you for the opportunity to be here today.

I'd like to congratulate you, Madam Chair, on your new role as chair of this committee.

I have been following the committee proceedings and I want to commend you for your hard work. I know that you will be studying the economic security of women during this upcoming session, and I appreciate your work on this matter, as we have identified it as a challenge facing Canadian women, particularly senior women.

I would also like to thank Ms. Mourani and Ms. Smith for their work on the human trafficking motion before the House of Commons. I know the committee spent a great deal of time investigating human trafficking.

While human trafficking is an ongoing problem in Canada, statistics from past international events such as the Olympics have shown an influx of human trafficking in host countries. With the 2010 Olympics around the corner, it is crucial that we have a system in place to deal effectively with the problem. Your work in this area will have a direct impact upon the lives of the women as we move forward.

I would first like to recognize the hard work of the officials of Status of Women Canada on the renewal of the women's program. Since my last appearance before you, there has been a great deal of discussion around the renewed terms and conditions of the women's program and new criteria for funding.

Canada's new government believes that now is the time to act, and we want to focus taxpayers' dollars towards action. We have the studies; we know there are challenges. Our government is looking at tangible ways we can make a difference now.

For example, the Department of Indian and Northern Affairs is dealing with matrimonial property rights for aboriginal women. Our government increased funding to on-reserve family violence shelters by $6 million. As well, the minister announced $450 million for improving water supply and housing on reserve, education outcomes, and socio-economic conditions for aboriginal women, children, and families—real money in the hands of organizations that are on the ground working to make a real difference.

In terms of human trafficking, the former Minister of Citizenship and Immigration developed a program to offer victims temporary visas. Human trafficking is on the rise, and the majority of those trafficked are women. Instead of their being treated as criminals, our government will issue temporary resident permits for up to 120 days and will provide the necessary health care required, free of charge.

As I have mentioned before, women's issues are issues that all of my cabinet colleagues are concerned with. The Minister of Human Resources and Social Development announced $4.48 million to help train and retrain women on social assistance in New Brunswick. This three-year pilot project, Partners Building Futures, will help women on social assistance get the training necessary to find jobs.

As well, the minister has introduced legislation, Bill C-36, that will make it easier for Canadians to access the guaranteed income supplement. The guaranteed income supplement pays out $6.2 billion a year and goes to 1.5 million low-income seniors, who are mostly women. This, Madam Chair, is a real change that will affect real people where they live.

In one short year, we have introduced the universal child care benefit to help women and their families in their homes; implemented hospital wait time guarantees for prenatal aboriginal women; expanded eligibility for compassionate caregivers, most of whom are women; introduced pension-splitting for senior citizens; and targeted tax cuts such as the GST, textbook credits, and credits for families with children involved in physical activity. Real changes, ideas, and policies are making a difference in the lives of Canadian families and women.

As I come before you today, we are in the midst of one of the most horrendous murder cases in Canadian history. The trial in Vancouver stands as a solemn reminder of the realities faced by the most vulnerable in society. This government is committed to action on justice issues. While this high-profile case garners the lion's share of national and international media attention, there are other stories just as heart-wrenching. There are stories in the paper every day about repeat offenders—men who have abused their wives, children, or girlfriends; men who are back on the street putting lives in danger because law enforcement does not have the necessary tools.

Domestic violence is an issue that this government takes seriously. The Minister of Justice has brought forward tougher legislation. We need effective sentencing when dealing with sexual predators and repeat offenders.

We need to end conditional sentencing and raise the age of protection.

If all members in the House and all members of this committee would like to make a difference to help women in their communities, I would urge all to encourage their caucus members to pass these bills quickly.

Canada's new government believes in supporting programs that have a direct impact on women. We believe in putting money into the hands of groups that will help women in their communities.

In October 2005, Canada was cited by the United Nations Committee on Human Rights as failing to adequately address the high rate of violence against aboriginal women. These women and their children deserve safe communities. That is why I committed to the multi-year funding of $1 million a year until 2011 to the Native Women's Association of Canada.

The Sisters in Spirit initiative addresses the high rates of racialized, sexualized violence against aboriginal women. This project will have a direct benefit on the lives of aboriginal women in their communities.

There is no simple answer. The economic insecurity of women can be traced back as a root cause of the problems faced by women on a daily basis. We need to ask how we can work together to alleviate these problems.

How can we work with the provinces to provide better services for women? I look forward to the committee's work on this issue. When a women faces domestic violence, what can we do to help her get out of this situation, find a job and a home, and be self-sustaining?

We need to let women know that there are other options enabling them the opportunity to change their lives. This committee is a wonderful vehicle to provide input to bring forward solutions.

As Minister for the Status of Women, I will continue to work towards achieving results for women across this country. I would like to suggest putting our partisan political differences aside and working with you. Together we should strive to ensure that we are making a real difference in the lives of women.

Thank you for the invitation to be before you and with you today. I look forward to our discussion.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Thank you, Minister.

We will start our first round of questions with Ms. Minna, for seven minutes.

[Maria Minna, Liberal, Beaches—East York, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Minister, for coming to meet with us today.

I would very much like to follow up on your last statement about being non-partisan and trying to be as objective as we can on these issues. At the end of the day, we're all here to serve the same thing. However, I do have to deal with the facts.

The government has eliminated the equality provisions of Status of Women Canada. The government has cut $5 million, 40% of the budget. The government has shut down offices. The government has changed the provisions so that advocacy is no longer funded, advocacy that goes to all of the things the minister mentioned a few minutes ago. All of those issues need research and advocacy. That's how they were brought to the fore in the first place by women's organizations and by your counterparts at the provincial level.

Minister, at this point I need to...since during question period you stated that the discussions today in Toronto will not deal at all with the issue of cuts. In La Presse today, the minister for the status of women in Quebec pretty much talks about only that:

Provincial status of women ministers are meeting in Toronto on Thursday to devise a common strategy to convince federal Minister Bev Oda to reconsider the decision to slash federal funding for women's programs.

That is one part.

She goes on to say:

She further stated: “The message that we're hoping to convey to Minister Oda is how important these activities are to women's groups and to the role women play in Canada”.

However, Ms. Théberge is confident that she and her colleagues can exert enough pressure to bring about a change of heart in Ottawa.

That is only one statement today, Madam Minister.

Prior to the meeting, there were other comments in previous media. From January 11, there are quotes from Madam Pupatello from Ontario. She states very clearly that at previous meetings, the minister did not stay long enough for them to have a proper meeting. Yes, they were having a meeting to discuss programs much beyond the cuts; however, a federal-provincial-territorial meeting requires the federal government to be present, and you obviously were not.

I'll quote from the previous article, again, just what the minister said:

It's hard to have an FPT (federal-provincial-territorial meeting) with no F. That sort of sums it up....It's just very frustrating because you feel like you're at the altar and the bride didn't show.

These are comments straight from the ministers at the provincial level, Madam Minister.

I'm sorry I have to bring this up again. However, given the fact that we are here to talk about equality for women, and that a lot of these things are federal-provincial partnerships, I would ask you, Minister, since then, in your conversations with provincial and territorial counterparts, have you reviewed the government's position on the elimination of the equality provisions, on the cuts, and on the closing of offices? Have you reconsidered and decided, hopefully, that in fact advocacy groups should be funded and that the equality provisions of the Status of Women are to be reinstated? Otherwise, the raison d'être of the department is in essence no longer in existence.

[Bev Oda, Conservative, Durham, ON]

Thank you for your questions.

If I may, Madam Chair, I will answer the direct question, but first I would like to address some of the other comments brought to our attention here.

As I've indicated, we've spoken to Minister Pupatello's office and have received a letter. The letter indicated that the purpose of the meeting was to come to a consensus on how they could make FPT processes more meaningful and action-oriented.

I can only take at face value unless we...and I wouldn't suggest this, of course, that we have something in writing, but we have a totally different message being said publicly.

I also understand, from a report that I received regarding today's meeting, that Ms. Pupatello explained to her counterparts the evolution of the public statements that were reported. I welcome learning that the ministers today have agreed to work together. They've agreed to come forward. I will be meeting with a representative group of five or six of those ministers, who are going to bring together a proposal on how an action plan...to work on an action plan. I will be with them in July in Iqaluit, where we will be discussing the next steps on an action plan.

I also understand, and I've agreed to meet, as I offered in our last FPT, which I was part of.... I had offered a separate meeting to discuss the terms and conditions they'd asked for. They are indicating that they would like this meeting, so that meeting will be scheduled. They've asked for that meeting to happen in February, and it will happen in February.

I also want to indicate that whatever way in which this meeting in Toronto was characterized in the media, I would like to say that I do not go by the media, I go by what other ministers tell me and what other officials tell me. I am told that the intent was to meet as provincial ministers. Provincial ministers in many areas, even first ministers, meet without federal representation in order to discuss their responsibilities and how they would like to come to an agreement or an understanding before they approach the federal ministers or their federal counterparts. I encourage that to happen.

I see this as a very positive meeting they have, and am very encouraged that they have identified the same three focus issues--of domestic violence, economic security, and aboriginal women--as the three focuses they would like on their part.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Your time is up, Ms. Minna.

Members of the committee, I would suggest that the minister is here to answer questions. You can make it an interactive session. If you could make your questions two minutes and then let the minister answer for two minutes, you could have a rebuttal, and I think it would work more efficiently.

Madame Demers.

[Nicole Demers, Bloc, Laval, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chairman.

Good afternoon, Minister, and thank you for joining us today. Good day to you as well, Ms. Ievers. I happy to see you.

I have a great deal of difficulty understanding the new measures adopted as part of the Women's Program. I'm having a problem with this because neither you, nor I, nor any of my female colleagues would be in Parliament today if women hadn't raised their voices and demanded to be recognized as persons, with the full rights this entails.

I can't quite understand the reluctance at the point in time to admit that a program aimed at promoting women can be used to defend women or to influence governments, whether federal, provincial or otherwise. Women have been struggling for over a century to be recognized as full and equal citizens, but the battle isn't over yet. In light of all of the changes that have taken place, I get the impression the department feels that women have now come far enough that they no longer need to make any more demands. I think the department is very wrong about this. I'd like to know why women's initiatives have been deemed ineligible for funding. I'm looking in particular at item 3 in the table “Current Terms and Conditions” in the Library of Parliament briefing notes.

[Bev Oda, Conservative, Durham, ON]

Thank you for your question.

I appreciate your question. I hope I can give you a fuller understanding of this.

Just even out of the provincial ministers' meeting that was held today in Toronto, I understand there was an observation made at the meeting that the Status of Women has been in existence for 25 years. There was also observation made that there have been many studies, and we all share in those studies. The results those studies show, I think, have identified what the challenges are, what the situations are.

We recognize that women, in their place in Canadian society, have not had the equal opportunity to participate as employees, as employers, as part of the social and civic activities of our country. What we are saying now is that recognizing what the studies have told us, recognizing what we know from 25 years of advocacy, it is now time when we must take action.

I must say that we are not saying, certainly, that they are advanced enough. We are not saying that they are not equal. In fact, because we believe they're equal we believe that we have to help them face the challenges they are facing, so they can express their equality and can participate equally in all facets of life.

In fact, I guess the portrayal that has been made is the removal of one word out of the terms and conditions. If you look further into the terms and conditions and into the application form, it recognizes that every project must reflect the place of women within the Charter of Rights, within employment practices that are fair and equitable, and those things are all within the program guidelines and the application forms--

[Nicole Demers, Bloc, Laval, QC]

Excuse me, Madam, but do you really think that you will attain your objective, namely meeting needs, by silencing women and women's groups? You won't know what these needs are because you will have prevented women from speaking out. How do you expect to achieve your objectives under these circumstances? The past is no guarantee of the future. We need to look not only at what's happened in the past, but at what's happening right now. If women can no longer make demands, then do you really think you can meet your objectives. I don't think that will be possible.

Women must continue to have an opportunity to voice their demands, whether it involves their lives, the quality of their lives, their health, education, or all of the areas in which they are now represented. If they are unable to do that, then their needs will not be adequately met. Past needs may be met, but not present and future ones.

[Bev Oda, Conservative, Durham, ON]

Well, Madame, this government in any action it has taken has never muzzled any individual Canadian citizen or group from expressing its views. We have not, by changing the terms and conditions of a program, muzzled anyone or taken away their right or their ability to express their views to each other, to the media, to their members of Parliament, or to any politician or person who has any participation in assisting their positions.

What this government has said is that taxpayers' dollars will not, through the programs available to women, be used at this point for funding of advocacy organizations. That does not mean that the advocacy organizations cannot continue their advocacy, as many groups do in Canada that represent the views and concerns of many sectors of the Canadian population.

I just want to be clear: we have not taken away that right and the opportunities they have, just like everyone else has, to express their views and to bring forward their points of concern. What we're saying now is that taxpayers' dollars dedicated in this area will be dedicated to organizations that will be able to provide direct help to women in their individual communities.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Madame Demers, you have 20 seconds. Go ahead.

[Nicole Demers, Bloc, Laval, QC]

You're taking away their means to act. It's the same thing.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

We will now go to Ms. Smith, for seven minutes.

[Joy Smith, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I would like to thank you, Minister, for coming to our committee and for your very huge involvement in the human trafficking issue that which members on this committee have all participated in. As you know, there is soon going to be a report tabled in the House of Commons on this very initiative that you, as Minister for the Status of Women, are very eager to hear, and I thank you for that.

Also, it's very true—I am a former member of the Manitoba legislature, and indeed you were perfectly right—that ministers do come together provincially before they invite their federal counterparts, because they get all their ducks in line and talk about the issues they want to bring forward.

One thing that has come up over and over again on this committee, as you said, Madam Minister, is that many studies have been done and now it's time for action. Women have not had equal opportunity in Canada, and I thank you today for recognizing that and the fact that our government needs to take action. We believe women are equal; it's the opportunity that we have to work on.

I just came off a tour in Ontario. I talked to a number of women's groups that really are applauding the efforts you've put forward. There was no mention at all of their voices being muzzled. They felt quite free to come to Ottawa and quite free to write letters and quite free to talk to me. There was the good and the bad and the indifferent, but they were very appreciative of the action that is going forward from the Status of Women in a real-world way.

I am hoping that advocacy organizations will understand that certainly they continue their advocacy; they're just not paid to do it. Many people are starting to realize that and appreciate that.

Madam Minister, perhaps I could ask you to comment on this. Because of my tour in Ontario, I had such a positive response about the revisions of the terms and conditions.... It wasn't like what I'm hearing often here at the status of women committee; rather, women were very happy that they could actually apply. It was as though the world had opened, and organizations that didn't have the opportunity to apply before are able to apply.

I'm wondering what kind of response there has been since the terms and conditions of the women's program were revised, and whether you would be able to tell us how many applications have been received to date and how many you expect to receive in the short term.

[Bev Oda, Conservative, Durham, ON]

Thank you for the opportunity to report. Through the women's program, the Status of Women office has received 56 applications.

In fact—thank you for this opportunity—I'm very pleased to tell you that the first project approved under the new terms and conditions is to the Prince George New Hope Society.

They believe this project will help sex workers and sexually exploited young women, particularly young aboriginal women in Prince George and northern British Columbia. They will be working with their community organizations, their law enforcement, the RCMP, and to ensure that....

They also have a program whereby they will be one evening a week on the streets describing what this organization offers. They have programs now whereby the women and the young women who choose not to live on the streets and to undertake this activity.... They have a workshop project going there. They also have management sensitizing law enforcement and the judicial system within that small community on the challenges faced by these particular women. Their expected outcome is improved opportunities for these women who are currently being exploited.

I'm very proud to make that announcement.

The other thing I will ensure and can assure you is that with the reporting requirements, the funds are going to be used accountably. They've reported that there will be 120 participants in 10 workshops, and this is the kind of real difference that these projects will make.

As far as other activities are concerned, those are under the women's program's new terms and conditions. In fact, there are many provincial ministers with whom we have been in conversation who have approached this government on the new terms and conditions with very meaningful projects they would like to see happening in their provinces.

We've been working with them, and hopefully, as we talk to them, they're actually supporting third-party, independent, non-profit organizations who work in communities so that they too can undertake projects that would help women in various provinces.

This is very encouraging. I think the thing is that we will see measurable differences in individual lives of Canadian women as we move forward.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Ms. Smith, you have one minute left.

[Joy Smith, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

I thank you very much. That's very exciting, and I know all of the status of women committee will really appreciate this information you've just given us.

Could I ask how many of these types you would anticipate? I know myself, after having come off the tour, that there is a group of women in Sarnia who are women against human trafficking, and they are looking forward to applying, as are many other types of.... And it really matches what we all here on the status of women committee have addressed, which is violence against women.

Could you comment on that?

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

You have less than half a minute to respond.

[Bev Oda, Conservative, Durham, ON]

Let me just say that the changes have been very encouraging. Of course, if after 25 years you were not allowed to apply, one of our challenges is to get the messages to those organizations who have never looked to Status of Women for assistance or support. But we have a wide range of applicants.

The other thing I'll point out is that your organization in Sarnia would never have had a Status of Women office in Sarnia, that in fact now the information's available on the Internet—

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Minister, I have to cut you off. Thank you.

We go to Madam Mathyssen for seven minutes.

[Irene Mathyssen, NDP, London—Fanshawe, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Minister, for being here.

We've heard that women in this country are equal, they just lack opportunity. I was quite interested in your statement, particularly the paragraph in which you asked the question about how, when women face domestic violence, we can help them to recognize the cycle of abuse, find a job and a home, and be self-sustaining.

Minister, I would suggest that there are a number of things this government could do that it hasn't done, and I'm hoping you will make a commitment to do the things that women across this country have been asking for.

For example, will you commit to real child care—affordable, regulated, not-for-profit child care? We know the plan that is currently in place has produced no child care spaces. Absolutely nothing has been created there.

This committee asked that there be proactive legislation on pay equity prepared. That request was denied.

We know women require opportunities in regard to training and access to employment insurance. Right now only 30% of the people who pay into it are able to access it.

We also know women are homeless because there aren't enough affordable homes. We need a national affordable housing program so that there is that housing stock. As the status of women minister, I'm hoping you will commit to working with your cabinet colleagues and your government to make this happen.

Finally, I would say that the empowerment of women is essential. Only 20% of our colleagues are women. That's not acceptable. We're far behind many countries in the world. In fact, Rwanda has more women in government than we have. I'm wondering what you have done within the governing party to make sure there is encouragement for women so that they can be included as participating members in the houses of this land.

[Bev Oda, Conservative, Durham, ON]

Thank you for your question. I certainly appreciate that you are actually identifying some very concrete actions that can be taken.

As you know, as reported, this government did commit to increasing child care spaces. The work that's being done by the Minister of Human Resources and Social Development was reported in the House.

Concerning pay equity, the announcement was made that we have existing pay equity. We're trying to enforce that more stringently, etc., and I know you will be speaking with the Minister of Labour regarding the pay equity legislation and his plans.

On employment insurance, I know we have made the appropriate minister aware of the request, and attention to that has been asked for.

On the homeless, this government has made a recent announcement regarding increased funding for a homeless program.

And on women in politics, I'm quite encouraged. I know there is another minister who is actively working on an approach of working with a non-profit, non-partisan organization on specific means of increasing participation of women in civic life and in politics.

[Irene Mathyssen, NDP, London—Fanshawe, ON]

Thank you, Minister, but I'm afraid you've fallen short in terms of the child care spaces and in terms of pay equity. Women asked for proactive pay equity, not the status quo.

[Bev Oda, Conservative, Durham, ON]

And I'm sure the minister responsible would be pleased to come before this committee to discuss with you the plans the minister would have.

[Irene Mathyssen, NDP, London—Fanshawe, ON]

I'd be delighted, and I hope the chair will make that invitation.

We're here to discuss the budget of SWC. I wonder what specifically is the budget for 2007-08. What have you allocated?