Status of Women Committee on Feb. 20th, 2007

[Larry Bagnell, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

You didn't talk about the non-smoking strategy or the justice strategy.

[Beverley Jacobs]

Well, the justice strategy, again, goes along with specific areas of women's decision-making and aboriginal justice, because there are very specific issues that needed to be addressed with respect to healing and wellness. And that's a whole part of what aboriginal justice is.

The non-smoking strategy was a huge strategy that was being implemented within our first nations communities, and it was working.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Thank you.

We will now go over to Mr. Stanton for five minutes.

[Bruce Stanton, Conservative, Simcoe North, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you to our witness this afternoon.

I actually heard you as a witness for the first time when I was filling in on, I believe, the human resources committee. We were talking about education as it related to first nations. It's good to see you back.

In your opening comments, and in some of the background notes that we studied in preparation for today, I noticed an interesting piece of information that suggested that aboriginal women are in fact outpacing aboriginal men in terms of their educational attainment. I hope that has a lot to do with what your organization is doing for aboriginal women. Do you have any comments on why that's happening?

[Beverley Jacobs]

I don't know whether it's the organization, but I think it has a lot to do with the advocacy that has been out there for a long time. I think aboriginal women and young women are starting to address the issues of oppression and healing and wellness, and a lot of those empowerment role models that are out there for young people I think have been a huge—

[Bruce Stanton, Conservative, Simcoe North, ON]

I don't mean to cut you off, but since I have five minutes, I'm going to try to move it along.

It's certainly a very encouraging trend, because all the information that we have seen would suggest that, as we move forward, issues of economic security and poverty all have a direct link back to educational attainment. In fact, even in our last weeks' presentations we heard this. And it's very compelling.

In fact, I'm reminded that our government has recently made arrangements with the Province of British Columbia with respect to a new educational regime that will in fact bring a higher level educational format to on-reserve education in British Columbia.

I know it's early at this point, and that MOU or that new understanding or that new regime for education on reserve in British Columbia is new. But do you have any thoughts so far on what kind of promise that might bring for continuing education for your people?

[Beverley Jacobs]

I think one of the things I have seen recently is that for those kinds of initiatives that are developed for aboriginal people in the communities, there's never a gender analysis done with respect to who is gaining the services. If it is aboriginal women who are the majority, then at some instance I would be worried in the future for our men. That's part of our culture, creating a balance between our men and our women.

[Bruce Stanton, Conservative, Simcoe North, ON]

It's a good point, although first things first, when we consider that it would appear that aboriginal women, from the standpoint of the kinds of circumstances they're faced with.... Being a woman is one thing, but then also being an aboriginal woman, as referred to in our background notes, is almost a kind of double jeopardy. So they are really coming from behind. I would say that, agreeably, we want equity in education, but it would appear that there is starting to be some good progress made.

Finally, I don't know if we have time for this or not, but we currently have a bill before the House regarding the repeal—I guess it's a repeal, but I don't have a legal background—of section 67 of the Canadian Human Rights Act with respect to removing the clause as it relates to limiting human rights for aboriginal peoples. Do you have any thoughts on that initiative that is currently under way in the House of Commons?

[Beverley Jacobs]

I'm actually glad you asked that question.

The Native Women's Association created a plan back in May of 2006. We had developed a proposal, and it was the proposal we had with the Law Commission of Canada, the Department of Justice, and Indian Affairs. We were having these discussions because we'd created a plan on how to implement something within the communities that would address human rights violations in the communities.

Unfortunately, we're not agreeing to an immediate repeal. We're agreeing to a repeal, but there has to be an implementation plan in place. There are issues that have not been addressed in the community, such as Bill C-31, and there's already a conflict in the community. It would open the floodgates for human rights.

It is a positive thing for women to be able to have access to it, but there are a lot of issues women are talking about in the communities. They want to be able to address this in a healthy way rather than in an adversarial way. What can we implement in the community before it's done?

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Thank you.

We said we would end this meeting at 4:30, and we have some committee business to do. If it's the will of the committee, I'll give three minutes to the Bloc member and three minutes to the NDP, and we'll wrap up with Ms. Jacobs. We'll then go to committee business, as we have some things to discuss.

Madam Demers, for three minutes, please.

[Nicole Demers, Bloc, Laval, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Ms. Jacobs, I attended a little luncheon last week hosted by the Aboriginal Healing Foundation, and it was explained to us there that several of these 145 projects that are now under way will come to a halt because of a lack of funding. The funding for these projects will go from 300 million to 125 million dollars.

It has been said that women have a head start on men in the area of education. Will the cuts we discussed earlier and those made to the Aboriginal Healing Foundation's projects threaten the advancement that women have accomplished over the past few years?

What can we, as members of Parliament, do in order to help move you towards greater autonomy?

[Beverley Jacobs]

I think the specific cuts are going to have a major impact on aboriginal women specifically. All of those are very empowering issues and strategies, not only for aboriginal women but for aboriginal people in general.

We can talk about the issues, the education system, and positiveness with respect to how aboriginal women have been able to gain what's needed. I really don't think it's going to end in the sense of women healing.

The Aboriginal Healing Foundation had many programs and services within aboriginal communities, and there were a lot of people who took advantage of those. Again, they were for specific purposes in the legacy of the residential school system.

I think aboriginal women wanting to better themselves is indicative of where we're at in today's society. They're saying it's enough. It's enough of anything. It's enough violence and it's enough control that you have over their lives. I think aboriginal women are moving forward.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Thank you.

Ms. Mathyssen for three minutes.

[Irene Mathyssen, NDP, London—Fanshawe, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

We're talking about the security of people and the security of aboriginal women. This is a two-part question. I'm wondering if aboriginal women have difficulties or face challenges in accessing health care. Secondly, would a national housing strategy, a real strategy that encompasses all of the country, help aboriginal women in terms of access to shelter and proper housing, so that they can be secure?

[Beverley Jacobs]

Health and housing are actually very specific issues that we were supposed to address after Kelowna. Housing, with respect to a national housing strategy, was something we also addressed in our position paper on matrimonial real property.

The issue of poverty and housing was a consistent message about the housing crisis on reserve. Even if a woman left her community or went out to find somewhere to live in the community, there was nowhere to go. And it's not only not having a house. Affordable housing and safe housing are also priority issues, I believe.

With respect to first nations and Inuit and health, when it comes to health services for first nations people, the health issues themselves have become bureaucratic ones. In a sense, what was provided in what a lot of our people have said about treaty rights—the treaty right to health—was the idea that I have a right to have the services I need. Now when we get prescriptions, they're telling us that prescriptions have to be paid for. If a doctor provides a prescription for a certain medication, when we go to the pharmacy, they tell us the Department of Indian Affairs won't cover it. They end up giving us a secondary, generic brand of medication.

That again goes back to our elders. This is something my elders have told me just recently. Why are they paying for this? This is something they were told was never supposed to happen. That's a real issue right now with respect to prescriptions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Thank you.

Ms. Jacobs, if you have some closing remarks to make, what I'd like to do is give you two minutes. Sorry, but you have been through this, and we need to maintain time.

[Beverley Jacobs]

That's okay.

I just want to again thank you for the opportunity to be able to present today. I wasn't thinking that I was going to be presenting as much as I did.

With respect to all of these issues that we're talking about, there's what I said earlier about levels of poverty. Whose definition of poverty are we talking about?

Economic security for future generations also goes to the issues we talk about when we talk about the holistic thinking on economic development. A lot of issues with respect to economic development are also impacting future generations.

If we don't start thinking about how the natural world is preserved for all of us, it affects who we are as human beings and how we live on this earth. We need to start thinking about those things, because they do have a huge impact on future generations.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Thank you so much for being with us and sharing your knowledge.

I know you have been here before; this is the first time that I have been present to listen to you, and I was really impressed. Thank you for those words of wisdom.

Committee members, I have about four things on which I need direction.

You have received in your packages briefs presented by various groups on the potential impact of funding cuts to Status of Women Canada. They were sent to you.

Next Tuesday the analyst would like to get your feedback as to how to prepare that report and what recommendations you wish to get into it. I would recommend that committee members please get up to speed on whatever has happened so far.

Madam, do you want to speak?

[Julie Cool, Committee Researcher]

I just wanted to let you know that we have prepared a summary document that summarizes the evidence received in the briefs. It will be sent to your offices. You will have it by Monday, if not Friday.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Do you mean you're going to spoil them like that? Okay, fair enough.

That Tuesday meeting could be a very intense meeting. That's what we need, right?

Number two is the report on trafficking, I was going to call it, but it's not called trafficking. What is the name we gave this report?

Here it is. I'll read it out. The title is “Turning Outrage into Action to Address Trafficking for the Purpose of Sexual Exploitation in Canada”. You guys chose that title. It should be ready by Monday or Tuesday.

Ms. Smith was suggesting that we all be there when the report is being presented. All of you will be in the House on Tuesday, so we will do it Tuesday.

I have read a draft press release and I find it perfectly okay. If you wish to have a copy of it, I am willing to pass it around. It's not translated at the moment; it's just in English.

[Joy Smith, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Could we have that draft press release sent to our offices to have it for our records? At our next meeting on Tuesday, could we all comment on it briefly? I'm sure it's perfectly fine.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Why don't we do that? The report is going to be released in the House on Tuesday. Please send your comments. We will send it ASAP, and then you can send in your comments to the clerk of the committee. That way we are not holding anything up.

I'll let the analyst, Julie, speak to the fourth thing we need to do, because we're getting a little confused about the title of what we're discussing. Is it economic security of senior women, etc.? We looked at the motion from Ms. Mathyssen in May 2006:

That, whereas senior women have the right to a fulfilling life with dignity, respect and security; and whereas, poverty levels are alarmingly high among single seniors and especially single senior women; pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), the Standing Committee on the Status of Women undertake the study of the economic security of senior women, including an exploration of income splitting and care giving, and call forward as witnesses representatives from the Department of Human Resources and Social Development Canada, officials from the Department of Finance, and the National Advisory Council on Aging.

After that you had a meeting to discuss it. I think, Ms. Mathyssen, you chaired the meeting. I was absent.

I will first let Julie explain what she understands, and then she'll take direction on where the committee wants to go with it.

Please go ahead, Julie.

[Julie Cool]

What we are sending out to potential witnesses is.... If you look at the briefing note that was prepared for today's meeting, there is a little blurb that outlines the context for this study. It's very short; it's two paragraphs. It talks about the economic security of senior women, but it's taking into consideration the economic costs incurred by women who decrease their labour force attachment to take on a greater role in unpaid caregiving, women's disproportionate share of non-standard work, and the lack of education and awareness of the long-term implications of work-family decisions among younger women.

It would be helpful to ensure that this is the question you would like the witnesses to focus on, because the title of the study currently stands as “The Economic Security of Senior Women”. With this context, that could be changed.

I just put this before you, because it does seem to lead to confusion.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Before Ms. Smith speaks, do you have the work plan that you showed me, please?

Let me just look at the work plan. Then perhaps we can get some clarity.

Ms. Smith is first. Go ahead.

[Joy Smith, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

I want to go back to the work plan, because I believe in the work plan, looking at this one. In our previous conversations, we had decided there are other avenues we want to look at as well. We said we would start off with the senior women, but I think we need to have some discussion around this today, because there seems to be some confusion.

We said initially that we wanted to look at migrant workers, at the single moms, at people like that. I don't think we have consolidated that with everything we have done since. Madam Chair, you are not aware of that conversation as much as.... Perhaps we could have that discussion today.