Status of Women Committee on April 18th, 2024

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, again, to the witnesses here chatting about the red dress alert and implementing it.

We have the officials here today because there is consensus regarding this red dress alert, but we're trying to nail down the technical issues. There seems to be a little frustration with not getting answers today.

Blue Sky Net has found that of the 285 northern Ontario communities, only 74 had at least 50% of their households able to access 50/10 megabytes per second high-speed Internet equal to 26% of northern Ontario communities. The same report found that of the 187 communities with a population under 1,000, only 41 have at least half of households able to access a standard rate of speed.

The Minister of Rural Economic Development has spent $7.6 billion since 2015 to improve high-speed Internet access in underserved communities, but even if you get access—which we see in the Auditor General's report that you don't have—Canada still has the highest cellphone bills when compared to other countries. If you have service and you can't afford it, you might as well not have it.

There's a major gap here. They're called dead zones and they're literally dead zones for women who go missing.

My question for Public Safety is this: You're saying here today that this isn't necessarily your file, but how would you fix this? How would you go back and say, “Okay, we need to work with another ministry to ensure that this happens,” and put that on a timeline? For taxpayers watching at home, can you tell us what happens in that process? What happens so that you get, “Okay, I'm going to go talk to this ministry to ensure that this happens”?

[Valerie Gideon]

Madam Chair, if I may, I would like to take the question because part of CIRNAC's role is to ensure that we produce annual progress updates with respect to the federal pathway that include all federal actions relating to the calls for justice in which the federal government is implicated.

As part of that exercise, we do have an update on call for justice 16.5, which is relevant here. As of December 2023, the universal broadband fund, which is led by Innovation, Science and Economic Development, is on track to exceed its goal of providing access to high-speed Internet to 98% of Canadian households by 2026 and to 100% by 2030.

I personally have also had deputy minister-level conversations with ISED to see how we could engage with other provincial-territorial jurisdictions, where they have identified areas of risk, to see how we could expedite cell tower establishment, just as was done along the Highway of Tears, which involved a collaboration with the provincial government and ISED in order to be able to fund 12 new cellphone towers.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Thank you.

We're out of time, but I just want to say that the AG report does not sync with what you're saying in terms of what has been delivered.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

Thank you, Ms. Gideon and Ms. Ferreri.

MP Damoff, you have three minutes.

[Pam Damoff, Liberal, Oakville North—Burlington, ON]

Thank you, Shelby.

I want to start by saying something that is not directed at you.

I do find it unfortunate that the current Conservative leader has removed a smart, competent, progressive Conservative woman as the chair.

It makes me sad, because Karen Vecchio has given her heart and soul to this committee. She was on the committee for nine years, seven as chair. I served for the first four years on FEWO with Karen. We did important studies. The very first bill studied by the status of women committee was Rona Ambrose's bill on sexual assault, and last year, I know for a fact, Keira's law would not have passed if it hadn't been for Karen's leadership.

She has relationships with women's groups across Canada. She has ensured that trauma-informed questions are asked, not only at this committee but at others, and she's always worked with women's safety and well-being ahead of any partisan interest.

I have no doubt that will continue under your leadership, Chair, but I do want to thank Karen, from the bottom of my heart, for her leadership and for all that she's done for the women of Canada.

Thank you, Karen.

My questions are for Public Safety. I'm the former parliamentary secretary for Public Safety and I find it really disturbing that you come here and say that you're not the lead on this.

You are emergency management, and I do feel that Public Safety really needs to start engaging in this more and taking this seriously, because a lot of what we need to do when it comes to the alert system rests with you. There's only so much that Crown-Indigenous Relations can do, and I'm really grateful that Marc Miller and Gary Anandasangaree have taken the lead on this, but it's time that Public Safety did as well.

Pelmorex has shown me their system. They're located in Oakville. If we wanted to add the red dress alert tomorrow, to Michelle's point, it could be done. They issue the alerts but they don't determine who does. It's a bit of a secret committee, this SOREM committee.

Can you tell us who's on that committee? Are there any indigenous people or are there any first nations police services on that committee?

[Kenza El Bied]

SOREM is the senior officials responsible for emergency management, and the members are representatives from provincial and territorial jurisdictions. They are all responsible—most of them—for emergency management. What we are discussing through SOREM is a conversation that we have been leading around the national public alert system.

This is what SOREM is responsible—

[Pam Damoff, Liberal, Oakville North—Burlington, ON]

My time is up.

Pelmorex also has an app that doesn't rely on cellphone service. I don't know if you're familiar with this.

Could you please send us a list of who is on SOREM? I don't know if the committee may want to bring them as witnesses.

[Kenza El Bied]

Actually, we are in the process of providing a one-pager on what SOREM does, the mandate and the membership. This is going to be sent to the committee members by next Tuesday.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

Thank you.

Next we have Madame Larouche for one minute, please.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Ms. El Bied, to conclude, I would like to address the question of the trilateral agreements that were referred to earlier.

How are you going to make sure these agreements work? What more might they provide in relation to the red dress alert?

[Kenza El Bied]

We have not yet signed any agreements, but we are working closely not only with our federal partners, but also with our provincial and territorial partners.

Since Indigenous Services Canada is responsible for the red dress alert, we are working closely with our colleagues in that department to see how we can move this project forward and put it in place.

It is not up to the Department of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness by itself to determine the process of putting this alert in place. Rather, we are working in collaboration with all our partners.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

Thank you so much.

Last, we have MP Gazan for one minute.

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Thank you.

Chair, I'd like to put forward a motion:

That the committee thank MP Vecchio for her years of service as chair of this committee.

I'd like to table that and to release the witnesses.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

Witnesses, we thank you very much for being here.

There is a motion on the table. Is the committee in agreement to adopt it?

[An hon. member]

Do we want to talk about it?

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

Technically, it wasn't submitted 48 hours in advance. Is it the will of the committee?

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

It's with the will of the committee.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

We're going to suspend for a few minutes and figure out what the next step is.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

As you know, routine motions generally need 48 hours' notice, interpreted as two nights, for any substantive motion to be moved in committee.

It's not a contentious motion. The motion has been put on notice. Can we ask for unanimous consent from the committee to move the motion?

[Anna Roberts, Conservative, King—Vaughan, ON]

Chair, can I add something?

We've all spoken on it.

I'm not sure where we're going with this motion, Leah. Everybody has thanked Karen. We all miss her. What is the purpose of the motion?

Could she explain it?

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Do we have unanimous consent?

I'm sorry. I'm just asking this procedurally.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

We don't have unanimous consent.

I'll start a list, if we have speakers for it.

Leah.

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

I wanted to move this motion because, like other members, I was very troubled by the decision of the Conservative Party to remove Karen Vecchio. I share this not because of the Conservative Party, although I have much to share about the Conservative Party, as you know. I share this because there is a culture in this House of Commons that demoralizes and excludes the voices of particularly strong women. Karen Vecchio, I have had the privilege to get to know....

Before I go on, I want to be really clear for the new chair: I think you're lovely. I welcome the new chair to the committee. I want you to feel safe. I don't want what I have to say make you feel unsafe. That's very important to me. I really mean that.

I'm putting this motion forward because I think women need to stand up for women in this place. Karen took the time to get know me as a friend, but, particularly, really listened to some of the issues that are very marginalized in this House and, I would say, particularly issues surrounding indigenous women.

Prior to my being elected in 2019, indigenous women were pretty much off the radar after the national inquiry. If it hadn't been for me pushing, along with the NDP, along with powerful women across party lines, as we have seen with the red dress study...without the level of passion that I have seen around this committee table, we would still be dying in the streets.

Inclusion and exclusion are intentional. I am really troubled that the voice of a woman who is highly respected by women across the country has been taken off the committee; a woman who was able to work across party lines so that this place, this committee, could be one of the only safe places in the House for women. This doesn't feel safe to me any more. This doesn't feel safe to me: that if parties see strong women in committees who threaten a political agenda, we can be silenced. That's how the right to choose gets threatened. That's how the rights of trans women get threatened.

This is the only place we have to lift up our voices to protect each other. I have gotten to know people around this table, and I consider you colleagues and friends.

I am so touched by the red dress study, and I am so touched by the work Karen did in working as the chair to make sure that we heard what we needed to hear to advance this quickly. We are literally dying in this country: That's how critical this committee is.

I don't feel as alone in the House of Commons, because I've worked across party lines with every single woman in this room. They have my back. I'm going to have Karen's back this time. I'm going to stand up for Karen Vecchio. I'm going to stand up for Karen Vecchio and give the middle finger to partisan politics and political posturing, including by the Conservative Party right now, which gave the middle finger, as far as I'm concerned, to a functioning committee that is fighting for our rights.

Shelby, you are lovely. Again, I don't think you're going to do a bad job. I think you're going to be fantastic. I think you're fair. You are a diplomat. You are lovely. I want to be very clear that what I'm saying is no reflection of your competence or of your not being welcomed.

This is why I'm saying that I hope what I'm saying doesn't make you feel unsafe, because you know what, Shelby? I will have your back. If you do things that step out of line, like fighting for reproductive rights or trans women, I'm going to have your back.

I'm going to have your back because I know that our voices in this House are really minimized. I'm going to fight for this. There are hills you have to die on. For me, this is a hill we....

This is probably one of the only places I feel safe in this place—what I've called a misogynistic, racist, colonial shithole. This is especially as a minority woman—one of 10 indigenous people in this place—in a seat that I was never supposed to be in. I feel like my safety has been violated by another colonial violent act. It was a misogynistic act by the Conservative Party against Karen Vecchio.

The other day, I was wondering, “Where's Karen?” I don't know what happened; I don't know what led to this. She's a colleague, and she's also a sister. We're sisters in this circle.

After almost every meeting, I leave here and feel hopeful. I'm so hopeful that maybe some of the reasons I came here and maybe some of the people who want me to fight for issues.... I'm hopeful that maybe it can happen because I see what we do around this table. They have violated that trust. This is a place that is known to be unsafe for women. Women in politics get harassed every day in the House of Commons. It's a place where we have said things in confidence and upheld each other's confidence. I don't know what that's going to be like now.

Now, I have a wonderful relationship with every Conservative member on this committee, including you, Shelby. I have good relationships with all of the Liberal members. I have a wonderful relationship with Andréanne Larouche. Do you know why? When I come into this committee room, it's my place to stand up for us as women. It's not just for women's rights. It's for putting studies out that people feel proud of.

I was so proud of this committee when, under the leadership of Karen Vecchio, we put forward a study on the connection between resource extraction and increased violence against indigenous women and girls. That's something that some of the men might have found to be really controversial. However, we made it really clear that this wasn't about resource extraction. Whether you agreed with resource extraction or not, this was about how they need to stop raping women in indigenous communities and how companies need to be held accountable.

We stood up for women. We stood up for women instead of big oil companies with big resource-extraction money, companies that are making money off the backs of indigenous women. We stood up for that. Maybe that's controversial for some of the parties in this House—I would say the Conservative Party, certainly.

I'm talking about the Conservative Party specifically because I'm really disgusted by what transpired with regard to my friend, my honourable colleague, Karen Vecchio. It's garbage that, any time a woman stands with her sisters against violence, on studies like oil extraction, it's seen as rebellious and radical—like somehow the raping of women isn't rebellious and radical. Somehow, we have to turn a blind eye because we don't want to tick off big industry.

This is concerning to me. I don't know where this committee is going to go. Are we going to let toxic masculinity pollute this committee?

I'm not talking to you, Shelby. I'm speaking in general. I want to be really clear that it's not about you, Shelby. It's about the broader issues and the systemic issues within the House of Commons.

Any time women join hands and say no to violence, are we going to be punished? We know that some of the studies we've done in this committee have been pretty edgy. Even in studies where people had different opinions, we came out the other way. What does that say—throwing Karen Vecchio out? Who's going to be next?

Are we going to have to listen, mostly to men in leadership in the House of Commons, or else the girls are in big trouble in this misogynistic place?

I'm sorry I'm taking up so much time, but this is a bigger issue to me than just Karen; this is about the fact that there used to be—and I hope we have it again—a cross-party women's committee where women supported women in this place. I'm waiting for the day that a trans woman is in this place, and we're not passing motions that threaten their safety—not just outside but in the House of Commons—by the Conservatives. Karen Vecchio supported trans folk, by the way. I worry that some of her progressive decisions impacted her ability to safely stay on the committee when she stood up for human rights.

These are the most critical issues of our time. We see 12-year-olds in the States having to give birth because they can't access safe, trauma-informed abortion care. These topics are scary in the House of Commons, and even in this committee, because everybody is worried they're going to get in trouble, but not me, and not my party; we're clearly pro-choice.

I've never done this before, but I'm going to stand up for Karen, because if any of you get in trouble in this committee, I want to let you all know that I will have your back. I will fight hard. I am a huge defender of women's rights, and I will fight hard for all of you because you deserve that solidarity. I'm going to show that solidarity to Karen. She didn't deserve what happened to her because of some of her progressive views, including having to deal with, as the chair—

[Anna Roberts, Conservative, King—Vaughan, ON]

I have a point of order, Madam Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

I'm sorry to interrupt you, Leah, but I think we should just go to the vote.