Status of Women Committee on Sept. 29th, 2022

[Owen Charters]

Thank you for the question.

With regard to the data I was referring to, I didn't speak specifically to suicide rates. We do know that suicide rates, and I don't have the data for that specifically.... However, we do have the data that young women report at twice the rate of young men understanding their own mental health as being fair to poor—so not great—and obviously that leads to suicide rates.

I don't want to speculate on the rates, because there are many factors, unfortunately, that go into what I'll sadly call the effectiveness of taking one's life. While there are more attempts by females, males are more effective at actually going through with it. I don't have those numbers.

The challenge we see is that for young women, it isn't just the family pressures and the other pressures that we've seen in the pandemic; there is a social pressure that comes through that we see in clubs, which is also coming through in tools in the online space—social media. We've spoken about this before. The challenge of bullying and seeing greater social isolation does not go away when you leave school. That bully is available on your phone at three o'clock in the morning, and it's very easy for people to pile on.

When we've had to teach about gender-based violence and about dating safety, unfortunately what we're seeing is that a greater proportion of the burden is borne by many of these young females in social image, in body image and in what they're expected to display as a perfect image online, as one example.

We would say that's what's contributing to some degree, but I think my colleagues at the table would be able to add to that as well.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Mr. Charters, as you stated, we are seeing an increase in the number of intimate partner violence cases involving young women. Recently, I met the director of a CEGEP in my region, who confirmed that the number of requests for help from young women who experience intimate partner violence was on the rise. We know that intimate partner violence has an effect on women's mental health. They are clearly and directly connected. That is what the data seems to be showing, anyway, in a CEGEP in my riding. Do you have anything to add?

The other topic that I wanted to mention was something that you have already spoken of. I was asked to replace a colleague who sits on the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National Security when the committee was studying online hate. As you said, it is a problem that has been exacerbated by the pandemic, but it already existed before. Not only does social media put pressure on young women in terms of their image, and we know that they are spending more and more time cultivating that image, but we also know that they are receiving messages that are increasingly hateful and that the level of violence is growing. Obviously, this brings us to the issue of mental health. All these factors are directly linked.

What can the federal government do here? Is it time to legislate in order to fight online hate?

[Owen Charters]

That is a big question. I think counteracting that requires a societal response and an educational response.

We've talked about policy responses that are to help young Canadians better control.... First of all, it's to require permission to do what they do online to some degree. There is a lot of unsafe space online, and if there is better control of it—in terms of the work done by some of our social media corporations—to better enforce the “right to be forgotten” when a child gets to the age of majority, to be able to delete and reset.... We've seen that Facebook has attempted to do some of this, but I think the effectiveness is quite low, and regulation around it needs some teeth.

We've submitted a brief in the past that talks about how we protect young people in the world of social media to some degree. But I think that, broadly speaking, we're going to need to do more work to engage young people in programs like ours and Gordon's to build better social connections versus understanding that they can use this sort of Wild West of the Internet to spread hate.

[The Chair, Conservative, Karen Vecchio]

I'm now going to pass it over to Leah Gazan.

Leah, you have the floor for six minutes.

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

My first question is for Gordon Matchett from the Take a Hike Foundation.

You identified, during your testimony, a number of young people who are questioning or exploring their gender identity, who they are, how they fit it and how they belong. You mentioned that the bullying and mental health struggles faced by trans youth especially—who are trying to live who they are and how they want to live their truth—are gruelling and even more pronounced.

The Canadian Mental Health Association indicates that LGBTQ youth face approximately 14 times more risk of suicide and substance abuse than their heterosexual peers. Can you expand a bit more on the kinds of support that some of the 2SLGBTQIA+ youth you serve are asking for?

[Gordon Matchett]

We're finding that many among the youth we're working with are really questioning their gender identity, and they need a safe place where they're able to explore that gender identity. What we're finding is that some days they may identify as male and other days they may choose to identify as female. They need that safe space where they're able to explore and find acceptance with their peers and the adults in the room.

That's not always true in classrooms. Here in B.C. we're very fortunate that there is a very fertile ground with programs like SOGI 1 2 3—sexual orientation and gender identity—that's swept through the B.C. school system and is providing that safe space. Here at Take a Hike, we have our counsellors who are able to work with those youth to go deeper and help them explore.

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Thank you so much.

My next question is for Owen Charters from the Boys and Girls Club.

Since the pandemic, what are some of the biggest challenges in terms of mental health that you find with young women and girls that could potentially be impacting their long-term mental health, things like burnout, depression and anxiety? One of the things we've been talking about is the impact of the climate emergency on the mental health of young people.

You also spoke about frontline workers. I was an ECE. I was a teacher, actually, and I was a youth care worker early on. There were still dinosaurs and palm trees. It was a long time ago.

What are some of the greatest issues that you see young people expressing feeling stressed about or that are impacting mental health?

[Owen Charters]

The answer to that question is interesting, because before the pandemic we did a survey of our youth to ask what issues were most impacting them and what they were concerned about. We talked about poverty and employment, which all came up to the very top. The topmost one at the time was, in fact, mental health. It's a reinforcing circle.

Some of the things you talked about are in fact what we hear from our youth on the reasons why. Before the pandemic, climate change, employment and academic success were contributing significantly to that, as well as what I just talked about earlier about the impact of social media.

Because of the pandemic, we've heard about social isolation and the breakdown of the connectivity, especially for young people. We all need it, but when you are going through the formative, transitional stages of your life, you need that social glue. That was ripped away from them, in some cases for two years, through lockdowns or their inability to connect except through screens, which we've all told them they shouldn't be on in the first place.

On top of that, they are now seeing the impact of an economy that is making their life more expensive or making their families' lives more expensive. They are seeing employment precarity for both themselves and their families. They're seeing that the ability to put food on the table is creating great stress at home.

Now, I think the climate change challenge has come back for them as they witness the impacts of hurricanes and a very hot summer. We know that was causing what I would call an outsized level of distress. It's a shocking level of distress for a lot of young people when they raise it in terms of its actual impact on their mental health.

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

When they talk about stress around the climate emergency, is there anything specific that they point to? Is there a fear of not being able to live a full life? What is the impact?

[Owen Charters]

Again, this is anecdotal. What I've heard are issues like they won't be able to have a family because there won't be a world to have that family in, or the inability to do anything meaningful to change the course of this or to see meaningful change being made on their behalf. It's about feeling helpless in the face of a crisis, which I think is the same in a pandemic. Feeling helpless in the face of a crisis is probably the greatest anxiety that any of us can experience.

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Thank you so much.

I have 40 seconds. I had a question, but I want you to have time to answer.

Maybe I'll bring it over to Ms. Thomas. Is there anything in terms of building on the climate emergency in particular?

[Krystal-Jyl Thomas]

I was nodding along.

That's what I hear a lot as well from young people. We don't have super young children, but we have youth. A lot of them are questioning whether they're going to have the ability to have children and whether it's going to be a world that will be sustainable for them to have that. Young girls are feeling that now. They're already feeling that they have to make tough choices because of the trajectory that we're on with the climate emergency.

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Is there anything we can do to—

[The Chair, Conservative, Karen Vecchio]

Actually, we're done. We'll leave that question for your next round, Leah.

I'm now going to pass it over to Dominique.

You have five minutes.

[Dominique Vien, Conservative, Bellechasse—Les Etchemins—Lévis, QC]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

I am going to speak in French very slowly, given that I am going to ask an extremely difficult question.

A joint committee on medical assistance in dying, which includes senators and members of Parliament, has been set up. We are reviewing the act, which states that in 2023, a person requesting medical assistance in dying may be granted access in cases where mental illness is the sole underlying condition.

Moreover, we have also been asked to look at the issue of mature minors. That is the one million dollar question. I know that you do not necessarily have a ready answer, but you're here before me now and I am a member of this committee, so I'm asking you. I do not have a personal opinion on the subject, but I was a member of the Quebec Government and at that time, I voted in favour of medical assistance in dying.

It is important that you are here with us today. If you could give us your opinion on the subject, I would be most grateful. Indeed, we need to hear all opinions in order to make the most informed decision.

[The Chair, Conservative, Karen Vecchio]

Who would like to start?

Go for it, Owen.

[Dominique Vien, Conservative, Bellechasse—Les Etchemins—Lévis, QC]

I choose you, Mr. Charters. You have the floor, but rest assured, this is not a trap.

[Owen Charters]

I'm not qualified to answer that and I'm not sure what the answer should be.

We are very much in the business of addressing what I think of as the frontline mental health crisis and giving every young person the opportunities they deserve and need. I don't think I could answer your question directly at all in terms of understanding what I think is the ultimate question, unfortunately, of what mental health supports could or might be.

In our case, we're seeing a lot of optimism. If we can do the programs that we do well, I think we can intervene early. That makes an enormous difference at those young ages. It's not going to be the solution for the rest of their lives, but I think it makes an enormous difference.

[Dominique Vien, Conservative, Bellechasse—Les Etchemins—Lévis, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Charters.

I would ask you and your organization to think about this issue. We would be most grateful if you could send us your thoughts.

Ms. Thomas and Ms. Jackson‑Brown, what is your opinion, as practitioners?

[Krystal-Jyl Thomas]

That is a loaded question.

In the last year, I haven't worked frontline due to burnout in the pandemic. I left the front line, but 15 years prior to that, I did work frontline on an assertive community treatment team, so I worked with people who were incredibly unwell. This is something that comes up often—dying by suicide, whether that's under MAID or under your own duress and your own hand. It's something I've had a lot of experience with.

Is it my opinion that people should die? I don't really have one on that, but I would support MAID services, with a caveat. What I would like to see is more preventative measures for our mental health services now so that people don't have to get to that point then. Drop the mike.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[Krystal-Jyl Thomas]

That's really what I think it is. If we don't want to face those tough questions down the line, then we need to start investing in preventative services now.

[Michelle Jackson-Brown]

It's absolutely about prevention, because the earlier we can intervene.... Like K-J, I was on an ACT team. The earlier we can intervene, the less likely it is that people are going to have significant, serious and persistent mental illness over the course of their lifetime.

Each time somebody experiences an episode or a bout of psychosis, their baseline drops, and we don't know if we can get them back up to where they were functioning before, so the earlier we can intervene, the better their long-term outcomes.

In addition, when we look at that, we're looking at the distress of the experience by the person. If we can have services in place that reduce that distress and give them quality of life, that's what we need to look at—the mental health supports and services that are going to support somebody with their quality of life.

At the end of the day, the person has the choice to decide what they need for their quality of life, so, with the same caveat as K-J, I would support MAID services, but we do need those mental health supports and services in place, both on an early intervention basis and on a long-term care and support basis.

[Krystal-Jyl Thomas]

This goes back to what we were saying earlier, and what Owen was saying. The burnout that's happening among our frontline workers is only increasing. That means wait-lists are getting longer and longer. Again, people are on these wait-lists waiting for services, and by the time they get them the problem has just been exacerbated so much more.

[The Chair, Conservative, Karen Vecchio]

Thank you so much.

Anita Vandenbeld, we're now moving it over to you for five minutes.