Evidence of meeting #23 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 39th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was agency.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Director General, Rail and Marine Branch, Canadian Transportation Agency
I'm essentially saying that the agency's normal 120 days would be operative if there were an official case before us.
Director General, Rail and Marine Branch, Canadian Transportation Agency
One hundred and twenty days is the law under the act. Obviously when we go to mediation we try to expedite the case as quickly as possible.
I should also point out that the agency can make an order out of a mediation if both parties agree. It has done so in the past in a number of different areas, particularly rail infrastructure cases.
Sometimes the parties want that because they want an official record. Mediation by itself is a confidential process. We don't discuss it outside the case itself. Sometimes the parties want it to become public, and we can do this in a number of ways. One is by their agreement, and the other is by issuing an official order, which happens.
Liberal
Don Bell Liberal North Vancouver, BC
Thank you.
My questions relate to rail issues and particularly the noise complaint aspect. That's been the subject of call-ins we've had on the telephone conference and the most recent presentation preceding yours.
How is the process of mediation covered? In other words, if there's a complaint from some location in the country, do you go to them, or do they come to you? What about the cost to citizens? Do they have to bear their own costs in appearing before you?
Director General, Rail and Marine Branch, Canadian Transportation Agency
The way this process is envisaged right now, in the first stage the parties having a problem would be encouraged to get together with the carriers to see if they could solve the problems among themselves. Should that not happen, they could apply to the agency under our normal standard process and we would open our process, in which case we would interact with the parties in the most efficient way we could.
Where there's a specific case involved in a distant location, our tendency has been to have staff from the agency go there.
Liberal
Don Bell Liberal North Vancouver, BC
You talk about having them mediate directly with the railway. I notice that proposed subsection 36.1(4) talks about confidentiality of mediation. If you have a group of two or three residents who are representing 25 to 100 other residents, from my experience as a mayor--and other members of this committee have had municipal experience--they have a responsibility to report to their representatives, their stakeholders, what they're doing and what's going on.
By virtue of this act, is the mere fact they enter the mediation referring to when it comes to you, or when there are discussions with the railway? When it does come to you, what are the restrictions on them being able to go back and get instructions from their group if mediation is suggesting through you that something happened? They have to be able to go back, and you can hardly muzzle 150 residents.
Director General, Rail and Marine Branch, Canadian Transportation Agency
Absolutely. Mediation is a collaborative process between parties, and we give the parties what they prefer. In some cases parties prefer confidential discussions because it's an active case before the agency, so that part is confidential. But in other cases they have no desire for confidentiality of any part of the process, in which case there's nothing in our rules that requires that either. So if they want the mediation to take place in some type of public forum or report back publicly, it would be up to the parties. If both parties agree to that, I can't see a problem with it.
Liberal
Don Bell Liberal North Vancouver, BC
My experience has been with the railways and negotiations for the use of commuter lines. The parallel would be that railways generally don't seem to want to have discussions that are as public as the residents might like.
What happens if the citizens say they want to be able to talk about it and the railways don't?
Director General, Rail and Marine Branch, Canadian Transportation Agency
In that case you would not have an effective mediation. One of the first things you have to do in a mediation is settle some of the classic things like whether you have the authority to settle, or whether you agree that it should be confidential or public. How much time do you have? What would be the outcome? Do you want it as an order, a decision, a private agreement?
These kinds of things are usually settled in advance of going to the actual mediation. Where there's a massive disagreement of essential items, then the mediation doesn't take place and it goes to the next stage, which is an official case.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
I would like to come back to Ms. MacDonald.
My hope is that, once we have dealt with this bill, we will see an end to misleading air fare and travel package advertising. That is what I would like to see.
It says in the bill that you may make regulations on the Minister's recommendation. But the Minister has to ask you to do it. Am I understanding that correctly?
Director General, Air and Accessible Transportation Branch, Canadian Transportation Agency
Yes, that's how the bill is worded now, that it would be upon the minister requesting the agency to make those regulations. If he were to do so, then we would start our consultative process to develop those regulations. Then it would go through the normal regulatory process, which is publication in the Canada Gazette.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
Therefore, if I wanted it to be automatic, the text of the bill should state that the Agency must issue guidelines.
I want to avoid any possible misunderstanding. Once the bill becomes law, it must be clearly understood by air carriers and travel agencies that their advertising must state all of the costs related to the purchase, the real cost, including all of the fees.
Have I made myself clear, Mr. Dufault?
Acting Chairman, Canadian Transportation Agency
You have made yourself clear. If the bill states that the Minister may request that the Agency do this, then the Agency will have to wait until the Minister makes the request.
Acting Chairman, Canadian Transportation Agency
And if the bill states that the agency must do something, then the agency will do it.
Acting Chairman, Canadian Transportation Agency
That is your problem to deal with.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
Agreed, perfect. That's all it is. I don't want you to feel uncomfortable. I have to interpret...
Acting Chairman, Canadian Transportation Agency
No, I am not uncomfortable. Our job is to enforce and interpret the act, and your job is to draft legislation.
Conservative
Brian Storseth Conservative Westlock—St. Paul, AB
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
I want to thank you for coming before us once again. I want to explore a bit what I've heard you mentioning a little, about the marine act and how noise is covered under it.
Would you say there are some similar circumstances—for example, those of residential home owners? Is it a relevant comparison?
