Evidence of meeting #27 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was report.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4:55 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Merv Tweed
Can I ask you to read the amended part? For my clarification, first, how would it flow at the end of that statement?
All right. I'm sorry. Read it all then, as it would read, please.
4:55 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
If I go to page 268, proposed subclause 36.2(1):
36.2(1) If section 36.1 does not apply, the Agency may mediate or arbitrate a dispute relating to any railway matter covered under Part III or Part IV, or to the application of any rate or charge for the movement of goods by railways or for the provision of incidental services, if requested to do so by all parties to the dispute.
(2) The parties are jointly and severally, or solidarily, liable to reimburse the Agency its costs arising from the mediation or arbitration.
(3) The person who acts as mediator or arbitrator may not act in any other proceedings before the Agency in relation to any matter that was at issue in the mediation or arbitration.
4:55 p.m.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
If I understand correctly, Ms. Borges, the proposed section 36.1 provided that the Agency could intervene when a dispute arose between the parties that was within the Agency’s jurisdiction. This amendment is to the effect that if the dispute were outside the jurisdiction of the Agency, a request could still be made to the Agency to intervene.
4:55 p.m.
Director General, Surface Transportation Policy, Department of Transport
That's right.
4:55 p.m.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
That could be done for all sorts of jurisdictions foreign to the Agency.
4:55 p.m.
Director General, Surface Transportation Policy, Department of Transport
That’s right, at the request of the shippers and railway companies.
4:55 p.m.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
Have you analyzed the extra work this will generate for you? Have you made an analysis, or do you trust the industry? I’m not certain whether or not they’re asking you intervene on all sorts of things.
4:55 p.m.
Director General, Surface Transportation Policy, Department of Transport
We have analyzed this and we think that as a result of this provision there may be a reduction in the quantity of work done by the Agency. At the present time, the Agency receives many requests from shippers and railway companies to perform arbitration. Part IV of the act provides for this process. Mediation is a faster process, it’s more amicable and much less time-consuming than the Agency’s formal arbitration process. They were the ones who asked us for it.
4:55 p.m.
Bloc
Mario Laframboise Bloc Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC
If I understand correctly, if you do more mediation, you’ll do less arbitration.
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
Charles Hubbard Liberal Miramichi, NB
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I think section 36.1 is very significant, and adding section 36.2.... Some of the complaints we get, especially in terms of railways, deal with problems with companies that you might call “captive shippers”.
In view of the fact that this just arrived, Mr. Chair, I would suggest we should move on from that section and leave it for another day or two, until next week, when we have a chance to find out what shippers may say about it.
It's not unusual that we'd leave one section of the act, pass over it, and get back to it in our debate later on.
4:55 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
I've had this particular amendment for some period of time. In fact, we indeed had it before the last meeting.
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
4:55 p.m.
Conservative
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
Charles Hubbard Liberal Miramichi, NB
Yes, but have we had time to disseminate the information to shippers?
4:55 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
Absolutely. In fact, it comes about as a result of requests from shippers and railways. So this particular section was brought forward afterwards, I believe, by shippers and rail, after reviewing—
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
Charles Hubbard Liberal Miramichi, NB
Do you have some examples of shippers who were satisfied with that particular application?
4:55 p.m.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
I wasn't there, but I'm sure the transportation department could provide us with—
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
Charles Hubbard Liberal Miramichi, NB
“We” is the government, but I'd like to have some examples before I vote in favour of it. I have no objections to voting on it, but I would certainly like to know more.
I know back home I'd like to deal a little bit with a company called Weyerhaeuser, who complained to me about being a captive shipper from the Miramichi. That's the reason I'm asking for a little delay in that, to see if they would be satisfied with that application.
5 p.m.
Director General, Surface Transportation Policy, Department of Transport
In fact, what this does is give shippers one more tool. Currently, they have a series of tools in sections 3 and 4 of the act that are formal regulatory procedures. What this does is offer them also an opportunity to use the mediation process, in addition to those other processes.
The kinds of shippers, as you're asking, that asked us to consider this are the same coalition I mentioned earlier, the Forest Products Association, of which Weyerhaeuser is a member, which asked for this, as did the Canadian Fertilizer Institute--so all of the coalition. It basically gives them another mechanism they can use. If they want to have discussions with the railways and they need a mediator, instead of going just commercially, they can come to the agency as well.