Evidence of meeting #13 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 39th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was navigation.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Safety and Security, Department of Transport
It must be one of the applications we received.
Bloc
Robert Carrier Bloc Alfred-Pellan, QC
Precisely. That is what I understand, except that it doesn't answer all of my questions, because it is public knowledge that the work on the river will begun in March, that is in one month's time.
I have never been able to get confirmation of the project's approval by Fisheries and Oceans Canada. Now I find out that your department will also be conducting some studies and environmental assessments. There seem to be many public servants working on this project, and it is not really clear who is responsible for what or when the approvals will be given.
Speaking of this project, you seemed to be saying earlier that there was a certain amount of cooperation taking place between federal government departments. I imagine that Fisheries and Oceans Canada had already advised you of this project before December 14 last and that you have started to share your observations with the department.
I would appreciate some answers or some details about this particular project that directly interests me.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Safety and Security, Department of Transport
We cannot give you any more details about this project today, but we can certainly pass the information along to the committee clerk in the coming days. However, as David explained earlier, as many as four or five departments may be involved in this process.
In this particular case, Fisheries and Oceans would need to give its approval in so far as the sturgeon spawning grounds are concerned, to ensure compliance with federal legislation respecting fish habitat. I do not recall the exact title of the act. An environmental impact study is required in this case since a federal permit is needed to go forward with the project. The impact of the project on the environment must also be considered. The same applies for us. When we issue a permit, even one for a provincial project, the environmental impact assessment process is initiated. However, we cannot deal with navigation questions until the environmental issues have been addressed.
We can do some checking for you with the Quebec region. No doubt our colleagues from the Quebec region are the ones coordinating this project. Otherwise, you could get in touch directly with Quebec region officials to find out more about this or any other project.
Bloc
Robert Carrier Bloc Alfred-Pellan, QC
Nevertheless, I would still like to get some answers from Transport Canada about this particular environmental impact assessment. It is important.
Do the two departments join forces to conduct one single environmental impact assessment, or does each department do its own study?
Assistant Deputy Minister, Safety and Security, Department of Transport
No. Most of the time, the two parties join forces to conduct a single environmental assessment.
Robert Carrier Bloc Alfred-Pellan, QC
So then, I should be able to get an answer or some information about this project quickly?
Assistant Deputy Minister, Safety and Security, Department of Transport
Yes, you should be able to have some information quickly. I am not sure whether these studies have been completed, but we should be able to give you a status report.
Bloc
Robert Carrier Bloc Alfred-Pellan, QC
It is natural to have some questions, since this Quebec project seems to be moving forward smoothly. In fact, it was announced that work is scheduled to begin in March.
Are you aware of that? In a case like this, are you asked to fast-track the process so that at the very least, approval to start the work has been given? That's my concern. As the Member for this area, I would like to be able to at least say that our federal government is monitoring the situation closely and will issue some directives accordingly. I'd like to be reassured a little.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Safety and Security, Department of Transport
Standard procedure is being followed. However, I am not familiar with this particular project. We will get some answers for you.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Safety and Security, Department of Transport
If we have answers to your questions, yes, of course.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Merv Tweed
You've committed to getting him the answer, or do you have the answer?
Manager, Navigable Waters Protection Program, Department of Transport
I just wanted to let you know, Mr. Carrier, that these things are done concurrently--the navigational study and the environmental assessment. The results of our navigational study, our navigational concerns, have to form part of the environmental assessment. So they're not done in a linear format but concurrently. I just want you to rest assured that our work is already under way on that, if not already completed, and we've fed that environmental assessment. The details with respect to the exact status, as Monsieur Grégoire has indicated, we don't have here handy, but we can let you know to the best of our knowledge.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Safety and Security, Department of Transport
I do want to reassure you, Mr. Carrier. From my limited knowledge of the Rivière des Prairies and the neighbouring waterway, it is highly unlikely that the response will be negative. There is every reason to believe that a permit will be issued in the case of these navigable waters since there are already several bridges spanning this river. This is merely one more structure. Small pleasure craft navigate these waters, not large commercial vessels. The odds are that approval will be forthcoming.
Bloc
Robert Carrier Bloc Alfred-Pellan, QC
The one exception is Fisheries and Oceans because of its reservations about fish habitat.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Safety and Security, Department of Transport
That's different. However, Transport Canada can approve a project even though there may be concerns about fish habitats.
Bloc
Assistant Deputy Minister, Safety and Security, Department of Transport
Yes.
Conservative
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
My understanding is, first of all, that the average process takes about 11 months from the start of receiving the application to putting it through. On the average, that's my understanding. Is that correct, very quickly?
Manager, Navigable Waters Protection Program, Department of Transport
For a larger project with substantial potential interference to navigation, you're probably about right.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
So it could be possibly two years for some projects?
Manager, Navigable Waters Protection Program, Department of Transport
For major dams, it could, absolutely. For Lower Churchill hydro-electric, for example, or Voisey's Bay--major projects--it could absolutely.
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
I have one question, in essence, and I would prefer to have answers in writing if they exist. It seems to me that it could take the committee two or three years to do a good job on this particular act. It just seems like a tremendous, amazing, huge task. It's 100-year-old or older legislation, and it could take us that long to do the job right, in my estimation.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Safety and Security, Department of Transport
The minister was kind of hoping you would give him a report by June.