Evidence of meeting #27 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was trucks.
A recording is available from Parliament.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Groupe Robert
It's 80% of 60%. It's true that you can get a little more, but in reality—my accounting background—once your deferred income tax reverses, you pay more tax.
Conservative
President and Chief Executive Officer, Groupe Robert
That's not something to be too worried about. That would my first step.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
Okay, so you would like accelerated capital cost allowance.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Groupe Robert
Second, Natural Resources Canada should take the lead by promoting natural gas. I've been to at least seven or eight meetings with Natural Resources trying to explain this and that and convince them. These people must receive clear direction to promote this product across the country.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
The department has actually produced a full report on it, so they are aware of it.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
What regulations can we remove to make it possible for you to succeed in natural gas-powered trucking?
President and Chief Executive Officer, Groupe Robert
It's full of restrictions. For example, in the municipalities, each municipality takes the habitation code and whatever, and they come and apply it to a resource called LNG that they know nothing about. They use propane as a reference, as I said earlier.
The propane standards are so high that it takes months and months. It took seven months in Mississauga, and it took a year in Boucherville, just to illustrate, and nothing has been built. You cannot order the station, which takes another year, unless you have cleared this up. That's number one.
Number two is that the vehicles are much longer. The trucks are about 1.5 feet to 2 feet longer. The regulations in Canada were made for trucks that were shorter, so now we cannot use these trucks everywhere. We can use them in certain corridors. The provinces, because they have their own restrictions, come and impose on you. They say, “Sorry, but your truck is too long.”
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
Does that have to do with natural gas or just the truck in general?
President and Chief Executive Officer, Groupe Robert
It's the natural gas. It's because we use these stupid conventional trucks with the long nose. If we were to use—
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
Are you saying natural gas vehicles are longer than traditional diesel ones?
President and Chief Executive Officer, Groupe Robert
Yes. In fact, the way these trucks have been built, the fuel tanks are much bigger. The tank you see is 7 feet long by 26 inches in diameter, but in reality only a small tank inside it contains the LNG. The rest is all insulation.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
So the length restrictions at a provincial level are an obstacle for you.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Groupe Robert
Yes, because with the EPA and with all the systems that you have and the anti-pollution measures that are imposed on the natural gas truck, you have to put a DPF, you have to put a catalytic converter, and you have to put an SCR tank. Once you put all in these things, plus natural gas, you use a lot of electricity. If you're wondering why, it's because we have sensors everywhere to make sure there is no explosion. This is using batteries.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
It sounds like the full EPA certification framework is geared towards diesel, then, not recognizing—
President and Chief Executive Officer, Groupe Robert
Absolutely. They have refused to do it for Westport technology, but they have adopted another technology in the United States, called EcoDual. That technology, which, trust me, is not even 25% as sophisticated as the Westport technology, meets the EPA, whereas Westport doesn't meet the EPA.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
Do you think that's a deliberate protectionist measure or do you think it's just an accident?
President and Chief Executive Officer, Groupe Robert
For me it's clear as crystal. For others, they will argue with lawyers for 300 days.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
Cross-border, we are an integrated trucking business. If we were to move our rules outside of the EPA certification, then how would we continue our cross-border business?
President and Chief Executive Officer, Groupe Robert
One thing is certain: sooner or later they are going to adopt technologies that will meet their EPA, but the EPA they will meet will not necessarily be the standard that we had developed in Canada for their EPA.
Once these trucks start to come to the border, between you and me, if you see one of our trucks running on LNG and another one, how do you know? This is the real question.
The truck of tomorrow.... You take an electric car. I drove an electric car last week for a test. I was at the corner of the street, and nobody could tell. It's no different with the trucks today.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
You mentioned EEA imports from Europe. Is it again the EPA certification that's preventing us from importing some of these high-quality trucks from Europe?
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
So we need to work on finding a way to remove those obstacles.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Groupe Robert
Euro VI is better than EPA 2010. Right now, here, here in Canada, if I want to import some Volvo Euro VI vehicles, which are 2012-2013-2014, right—