Transport Committee on Nov. 6th, 2018

[Natasha Rascanin]

Yes, these are legislative amendments that we recommended.

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

You recommended them.

When would you have recommended them?

[Natasha Rascanin]

They have been in the works for quite a while.

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

For a long time.

In other words, getting back to what my colleague was questioning about, the whole consultation process under the oceans protection plan then seems to be a bit of a sham.

[Natasha Rascanin]

Respectfully, I don't agree with that.

We have been consulting.

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

You were making your recommendations without listening to the submissions of folks who are directly affected by these particular pieces of legislation. You had to have, without waiting for the submissions to come in from the various stakeholders.

Is that correct?

[Natasha Rascanin]

No, that is not correct.

We have been talking—

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

The submissions didn't close until October 26. We've just talked about a timeline we've gone through.

[Natasha Rascanin]

That is for one piece of the consultative process. We have been consulting for a number of years on these very important measures.

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

This is the oceans protection plan, which is a signature piece of legislation by the Government of Canada. I presume that the reason you did the consultation was that it was such a significant piece of legislation. You went ahead and made these recommendations before you heard all of the submissions from the stakeholders.

Is that right?

[Natasha Rascanin]

No, that is not correct.

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

Is that correct?

[Natasha Rascanin]

My answer is no.

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

No. How could you say that, sitting in front of this committee, when stakeholders had until October 26 to submit their submissions?

[Natasha Rascanin]

We have done intensive consultation. We have had numerous meetings with various stakeholders.

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

No, I'm talking about this consultation process on the oceans protection plan specifically that you launched as a department, as a consultation for stakeholders to have their input.

Will you admit today that you did not wait until you got all of the submissions from the stakeholders before making these recommendations? Will you say that to the committee?

[Natasha Rascanin]

My position and my statement is that we have been consulting extensively and we have been—

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

Okay, so the answer is no.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Next is Mr. Badawey.

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you, folks, for being here today.

I will show you the respect that you deserve based on the work that you have done.

What I want to do is drill down on the—

[Ron Liepert, Conservative, Calgary Signal Hill, AB]

[Inaudible—Editor]

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

—emergency preparedness response that I'm sure you've worked on with governments at the local level on many occasions.

You mentioned the fact, first off, that there's a reserve in place for about $410 million, the reserve that Mr. Bertin has accessed when you have these responses to embark on.

When you work with different emergency services, as well as local municipalities, when you have an emergency response situation, are those municipalities and/or services of different agencies able to access that $410 million to recoup the costs? I'm sure that reserve is also recouped through the polluters who must pay when they pollute and that keeps topping it up as time goes on.

Are governments at the local level, as well as different agencies, able to access that reserve?

[Marc-Yves Bertin]

Absolutely. Any individual, including level of government, is able to access, to make a claim to the administrator of the ships from some of the pollution fund, and after review, receive compensation either for damages or their role in responding to a spill.

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

Again, I'm not going to try to coerce you into giving me the answers that I want. I want to get answers that are actually sincere and truthful, as well as to further this process along in due respect to those who are involved as well as affected by it. I'll make that very clear from the outset.

That said, with respect to working and aligning of jurisdictional responsibilities, is there a protocol or process in place that, before the fact, before situations do happen, aligns one jurisdictional responsibility? When I say jurisdictional, I don't just mean levels of government but also different agencies.

Also, is there a process aligning established protocols of ministerial responsibilities? In my former life, I've often seen a fracture internally—and when I say internally, I mean a certain level of government—with respect to one ministry not recognizing or not having knowledge of the responsibility of another and therefore there's a bit of stumbling that happens.

Are those jurisdictional responsibilities and ministerial responsibilities in place so that when these situations do happen, it's a seamless process?

[Marc-Yves Bertin]

I might turn to my colleagues at the Coast Guard to answer, in terms of how we deal with and align the various players in an incident. I would only say that with respect to ministerial responsibilities and accountabilities, the statutes clearly lay out the roles of the various ministers involved here, the Minister of Fisheries and Oceans and the Minister of Transport, as well as when they consult one another and in which context.

Why don't I turn it over to my colleagues from the Coast Guard.