Evidence of meeting #120 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was noise.
A recording is available from Parliament.
11:25 a.m.
NDP
Robert Aubin NDP Trois-Rivières, QC
Thank you.
I have a quick question for Mrs. Maziarczyk.
You suggested creating an independent ombudsman. Does that mean you think the airports' consultation process with citizen committees isn't working?
11:25 a.m.
Saulius Brikis Director, Markland Wood Homeowners Association
It's important to understand that the Greater Toronto Airports Authority, or GTAA, is semi-independent. It's growing without strict supervision from the Government of Canada. An agreement between the City of Toronto and the GTAA was proposed in 2000. That agreement would have required the airport to obey certain rules regarding high noise levels, pollution and land use. But the agreement was never signed, and we don't know why. Neither party was interested in becoming good neighbours.
Business at the airport has picked up very quickly, leading to major public health and operational safety issues. Between 2012 and 2017, the Transportation Safety Board of Canada investigated 25 close calls there. This is problematic. That's why we are calling for an ombudsman.
11:25 a.m.
NDP
11:25 a.m.
NDP
Robert Aubin NDP Trois-Rivières, QC
I'll be quick.
I have a personal question for Mr. Prince and Mr. Laquerre. You don't have to answer if you don't want to, but your answer would give us some insight. Both of you moved away. Did you have to sell your old houses at a loss? Are neighbourhoods being ruined because people are selling up at a loss so they can move away?
11:25 a.m.
As an Individual
The flyover issue isn't being talked about at the moment. I think it's a taboo subject. To answer your question, when I bought my new property, nobody mentioned that we were in an air corridor. That question seems to be out of bounds.
To come back to something you mentioned earlier, I can tell you that in 2014, the public health department of the Montreal health and social services agency issued a public health notice about the health risks associated with noise from aircraft movements at Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport. I can send you a copy if you're interested.
11:25 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Judy Sgro
Can you please send that off to us?
Mr. Wrzesnewskyj, go ahead for five minutes.
11:25 a.m.
Liberal
Borys Wrzesnewskyj Liberal Etobicoke Centre, ON
Thank you, Madam Chair.
Just before the clock starts, I have a quick question. There was an undertaking by Transport Canada in a previous meeting to provide the documentation that would give us clarity on who authorized the increase in the budget for night flights at the GTAA, whether it was the minister or Transport Canada itself. I was just curious as to whether we have received the documentation that will provide that clarity.
11:30 a.m.
Liberal
Borys Wrzesnewskyj Liberal Etobicoke Centre, ON
Thank you.
I'll go now to my questions.
Monsieur Prince, you talked about the billions of dollars of profits that seems to be guiding decision-making. We heard from Nav Canada. They used an ethical fig leaf to say they're reducing their carbon footprint, but it appears that the naked truth of it is that it's all about billions of dollars of profits. From the Toronto end, I understand that, without having consulted neighbourhoods, which they were obligated to do, they changed the Montreal/Toronto flight path at the Toronto end to reduce the flights by one minute, which provided great savings for the airlines that regularly fly that corridor but also impacted the neighbourhoods in the Don Valley region of Toronto. All of a sudden, neighbourhoods that didn't have noise were impacted.
The fig leaf they're using is that this reduces carbon emissions, but the airlines are very happy with the profits. Municipalities restrict heavy trucks through residential neighbourhoods, especially at night. They haven't abdicated their responsibilities. It's the federal government's responsibility with regard to airspace.
Perhaps you'd like to make a comment about Nav Canada and its arm's-length relationship with Transport Canada, the government. How often do they consult with your neighbourhoods when they make these decisions that impact your quality of life?
11:30 a.m.
As an Individual
As I mentioned, I noticed that flight altitudes have been lowered in Laval without any consultation, which goes against the protocol.
Nav Canada's 2012 annual report said that the new corridors would save customers of the Vancouver, Calgary, Toronto and Montreal airports $7 billion in fuel costs by 2020. I take it that in 2016, the carriers that control Nav Canada were looking for ways to maximize their profits. Did they lower flight altitudes over Laval, near Montreal, or maybe in Toronto as well, so they could save on fuel? They claim they're reducing their greenhouse gas emissions, but that excuse doesn't hold water, because they're still polluting. They're patting themselves on the back for reducing greenhouse gas emissions, but they're still inflicting noise pollution on me.
11:30 a.m.
Liberal
Borys Wrzesnewskyj Liberal Etobicoke Centre, ON
Thank you.
Thank you for that.
So there was no consultation—
11:30 a.m.
Liberal
Borys Wrzesnewskyj Liberal Etobicoke Centre, ON
—just as there was no consultation at the other end, in Toronto.
I'd like to speak to that particular issue of lack of accountability, whether it's NavCan or the GTAA. They have this so-called CENAC noise committee. Where do those meetings take place, in what building?
11:30 a.m.
Director, Markland Wood Homeowners Association
They take place on the main airport, at the GTAA head offices generally.
11:30 a.m.
Liberal
Borys Wrzesnewskyj Liberal Etobicoke Centre, ON
They hold the meetings in their offices. Who runs the meetings?
11:30 a.m.
Director, Markland Wood Homeowners Association
It's hosted by the airport authority, with representatives from local municipal governments.
11:30 a.m.
Liberal
Borys Wrzesnewskyj Liberal Etobicoke Centre, ON
The actual authority is the federal government, but this CENAC committee—this noise committee they've structured—runs the meetings in its offices, and there's once again a fig leaf of municipal councillors who actually have no say politically in the decision-making process. It appears that it's a facade.
Of course, they're the ones generating the noise, so they should provide the resources, but there should be an arm's-length noise committee that actually has real say and power.
11:35 a.m.
Director, Markland Wood Homeowners Association
I agree. We all know about the health effects of airport noise on the population. An interesting model is that the City of Toronto has some type of health oversight over Billy Bishop airport. It's been in place for several years, yet there's no type of health-related oversight over the GTAA.
For a measure of accountability to start the accountability process for the GTAA, perhaps we should get the public health departments involved in providing oversight over noise emissions of the GTAA. That would be a start. Other implementations such as land use safety can come into place at a later time, but using public health agencies would be my suggestion.
11:35 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Judy Sgro
Thank you very much to the witnesses. We hear your frustration. If you could send in any of your documentation to the clerk for circulation to all committee members, we would very much appreciate it. Thank you all very much for taking the time to come today. We will be continuing this study at several other meetings.
Thank you to the members. We've been here since eight o'clock this morning, so it's been a very long day. Thanks to everybody for their patience.
I move that the meeting be adjourned.