Transport Committee on May 16th, 2016

[Laureen Kinney]

I think I should just note a couple of points, if I may.

One point is that the rules system is somewhat in place because the rail industry in Canada, and in the U.S. for that matter, is not part of an international regime that sets international regulations, etc. This is something that is a little bit different from our other transportation modes, and there is, I think, a reason why the operation of those very complex types of details of operation come forward from the industry. They must be approved by Transport Canada. If we aren't satisfied with them, we will direct them to make amendments, and that's happened in a number of cases.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Of course, they could be promulgated by regulation.

[Laureen Kinney]

There's a legal framework set in place under the Railway Safety Act, which had a very rigorous review a few years ago. There were amendments made to the Railway Safety Act in the last year and a half or so, and Parliament has set up that framework, so I won't comment on that.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Do communities get an opportunity to review rules before they're approved by the department?

[Laureen Kinney]

That is a good question, because one point I was going to make was that the development of these rules must include the workforce, the labour organizations. Before these rules can be presented to Transport Canada, I think it's important to note that they must be shared with the unions that are involved in that work.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

My question was about communities.

[Laureen Kinney]

At this point, there's no formal process in the legislation that requires sharing with communities.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Exactly.

[Laureen Kinney]

What we have been doing informally is discussing this with the Federation of Canadian Municipalities, but this is a point that no doubt will need further discussion.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

So there could potentially be an amendment to give the potentially impacted communities a say in the rule-making. That might be a gap in the legislation.

It's odd that when companies are transporting their petroleum products by pipeline, they have to go through a Canadian environmental assessment process; given the scale and the magnitude of potential risk with the kind of traffic by the rail companies now, do you think it may be time to in fact be applying the same kind of process to the transport by rail?

[Laureen Kinney]

It's an interesting question, but I'm not really enough of an expert on the CEA process to be able to comment on that.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Has the department been looking into that at all, on whether or not you think you have adequate means to be assessing the level of risk?

[Laureen Kinney]

Well, in terms of the railway system, with the safety management system as well as the other regulations that apply in terms of safe carriage of goods and the Transportation of Dangerous Goods Act and their regulations, we do believe we have a safe system in place.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Iacono.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

According to the Teamsters Canada Rail Conference, the act does not define “qualified operator” and “operator control unit”. Moreover, there is no limit on the distance from which a control device can be used to operate a train, or on train length or tonnage.

My questions are as follows.

What training is a required for operators of a train remote control device? What are the characteristics of the remote control technology that can be used to operate a train? Why is there no limit on trip length or train size for which a remote control device can be used to operate a train?

[Brigitte Diogo]

Thank you for your questions.

The railway operating rules define what a qualified employee is. The term “employee” is defined in the regulations.

As to distance and train tonnage, we have reviewed the comments we received recently, not only from unions, but also from the Transportation Safety Board. In early June, we will be meeting with industry and union representatives. We will put this issue on the table for discussion and see if any changes to the regulations are in order. The current limit for the speed of this technology and the rules on tonnage and distance are U.S. directives, which do not apply to Canada. We are looking into this matter however.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

What about train length or size?

[Brigitte Diogo]

We did a comparative study between Canada and the United States to review the lessons learned that we will have to apply in the Canadian context.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Is Transport Canada planning any other studies regarding the safety of remote control devices?

[Brigitte Diogo]

We have not yet determined which changes we will be making or what studies we will be conducting. We would like to meet with the parties in early June to discuss how to improve the use of this device. One of the factors is training. Under the rules currently, the operator using this equipment has to have the same training as a locomotive engineer.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

I have a final, brief question.

Is this remote control device for trains in use now?

[Brigitte Diogo]

Yes.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

I am talking about training. Is it used in the training?

[Brigitte Diogo]

Yes.

[Angelo Iacono, Liberal, Alfred-Pellan, QC]

Is it used often or just occasionally?