Evidence of meeting #46 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was cities.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Kevin Quigley  Scholarly Director, Dalhousie University, MacEachen Institute for Public Policy and Governance, As an Individual
Cathy Heron  Councillor, City of St. Albert, and Co-Founder, Alberta Smart City Alliance
Sehl Mellouli  Full Professor, Université Laval, Faculty of Business Administration, As an Individual
Kevin Miller  Director of Public Policy, ChargePoint
Vicki-May Hamm  Mayor, Ville de Magog
Bill Hutchison  Co-Founder and Chair, i-Canada

12:25 p.m.

Mayor, Ville de Magog

Vicki-May Hamm

Yes. Certainly. The Union des municipalités du Québec could provide it.

We conducted a benchmarking analysis by caucus size. As you know, at the Union des municipalités du Québec, we're organized into skilled caucuses. Since small municipalities have different realities, we conducted a benchmarking analysis so that each municipality could find similar examples of its reality around the world. This resulted in an analysis framework of six factors, which will become a self-diagnostic tool for municipalities.

We would be pleased to provide the information.

12:25 p.m.

Conservative

Alain Rayes Conservative Richmond—Arthabaska, QC

Okay. Thank you.

I see the clerk nodding to indicate that the analysts will take care of obtaining the document.

I want you to speak a bit more about the open data issue. You provided examples for different levels of government, or at least for Quebec. One intergovernmental organization out of two or three makes the data available.

Why is certain data currently not available? Is it a regulation or legislation issue? Is it the result of the culture of organizations, which aren't very interested in sharing the information?

12:25 p.m.

Mayor, Ville de Magog

Vicki-May Hamm

I think it's a bit of everything. There's the culture and there's certainly resistance because we're talking about organizations that have historically protected the data and that manage access to information legislation. They like to maintain control of the data. They have concerns. There is indeed a culture issue and certain legislation needs to be changed, but there must also be some reflection.

We can draw inspiration from what has been done in Europe. We also need to consider how to make the data available, because the process must be standardized. We can't just make our data accessible. The data must also be usable. Other countries have had bad experiences. It wasn't catastrophic, but the data wasn't usable. There's also the data standardization issue. The Quebec government has launched a good initiative, the Données Québec site. It's new, and there isn't much data available yet. I think we're heading in that direction, but carefully.

12:25 p.m.

Conservative

Alain Rayes Conservative Richmond—Arthabaska, QC

One last question comes to mind.

What has the federal government done, what is it currently doing and what can it do in the future to help you develop the concept of a smart city at the Union des municipalités du Québec or as the mayor of Magog?

In addition, if you had to make a recommendation that the committee could include in its report to help you improve your work, make your job easier and continue to develop, what would the recommendation be?

12:25 p.m.

Mayor, Ville de Magog

Vicki-May Hamm

To my knowledge, the help we've received came from different programs aimed at connecting the communities. I don't know about anything else.

Unfortunately, even today, many regions don't have access to high-speed Internet. They can't develop at the same rate as the other municipalities. This seems to be the top request, and it's made often. This is the subject that has come up the most since I entered politics. I hope that, at some point, everyone will be properly connected. There's also the issue of open data on the federal government side.

I think the federal government could help us enormously with those two things.

12:30 p.m.

Conservative

Alain Rayes Conservative Richmond—Arthabaska, QC

Thank you, Ms. Hamm.

12:30 p.m.

Mayor, Ville de Magog

Vicki-May Hamm

Thank you, Mr. Rayes.

12:30 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Judy Sgro

Thank you very much.

Mr. Fraser.

12:30 p.m.

Liberal

Sean Fraser Liberal Central Nova, NS

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I also want to ask Ms. Hamm a question.

You mentioned that infrastructure investments can help attract new residents. What kinds of investments make the biggest difference? This is very important for Nova Scotia.

12:30 p.m.

Mayor, Ville de Magog

Vicki-May Hamm

I want to make sure that I understood the question. Is the question for me?

12:30 p.m.

Liberal

Sean Fraser Liberal Central Nova, NS

Yes.

12:30 p.m.

Mayor, Ville de Magog

Vicki-May Hamm

Can you repeat your question since I didn't understand it?

12:30 p.m.

Liberal

Sean Fraser Liberal Central Nova, NS

Can I ask my questions in English?

12:30 p.m.

Mayor, Ville de Magog

Vicki-May Hamm

Yes, no problem. I'll answer you in French, but I understand English very well.

12:30 p.m.

Liberal

Sean Fraser Liberal Central Nova, NS

You've mentioned that infrastructure investments can help attract new residents. This is one of the biggest issues for my province.

What kinds of investments do you think make the biggest difference in helping to attract new residents?

12:30 p.m.

Mayor, Ville de Magog

Vicki-May Hamm

The first thing is to have access to infrastructure. For example, at home, the fibre-optic network was launched. This helped attract businesses when we had an aging population issue, as is the case in many regions of Quebec. This helped attract information technology businesses to our area, and people who wanted to telework. They can now do so.

This meant that, as we saw with the last statistics, there was labour force growth and not only aging population growth. This type of infrastructure makes a big difference.

12:30 p.m.

Liberal

Sean Fraser Liberal Central Nova, NS

Thanks very much.

Shifting gears to you, Mr. Hutchison, you used the example of the savings in health care if we were to make investments in certain communications infrastructure. How do you think the federal government can best target its investments to achieve social or economic savings?

12:30 p.m.

Co-Founder and Chair, i-Canada

Bill Hutchison

That's a great question. Thank you.

First, we need to have a decent level of broadband. For a federal program, it's important to have large cities, small cities, and remote and rural communities in it.

In Nova Scotia, for example, with i-Canada we've been creating i-Valley in the Annapolis valley. Ten quite small cities, led by Berwick, got together, have signed off, and are going to create a intelligent region.

Let me just say—this comes back to an earlier question about something that the federal government might do—that one of the programs the United States has introduced is the smart gigabit cities clusters program, called the “Smart Gigabit Communities” program. You may know that they've spent a lot of money in Columbus, Ohio—$40 million—to create an automated vehicle place, but the cluster idea is to encourage cities to come together as clusters and communities, small communities.

The government is giving them a couple of things in terms of using the research and education networks like CANARIE—you have one in Nova Scotia—and giving them access to that to create a high-speed broadband capability in certain districts such as Main Street or or start-up districts. They get the clusters together. In the States, they have 15 cities—not San Francisco or New York, but Kansas City and smaller ones. They give them some support, but then they say to all of them that got together that each of them has to develop two new broadband applications, and they have to agree to share those new applications with, in their case, the other 14 communities.

All of a sudden, you're getting some new applications. It could be in health care or in other areas, but you're spreading the wealth, if you like, or the program, to include a lot of communities. Now i-Canada is working on this, and we've created an area that we call the “Rising Communities Caucus”, and these are the smaller communities. That's what i-Valley in the Annapolis Valley is. Health care is only just one big area. There are a lot of other savings.

Six years ago, I was in Västerås, Sweden. A kid broke his arm, or thought he did. From his home, they clicked on the Red Cross icon on their TV. Up came a nurse. The nurse told him to step by the camera and to do this and that with his arm. She said that she didn't think it was broken but she would get the doctor. Imagine having this sort of diagnostics from the home, compared to jamming up the emergency sections and everything.

On the cluster idea, in addition, the Government of Canada has announced the smart cities challenge. They are going to do as the U.S. did, which meant $40 million for that one city. I think this cluster idea can help a lot of cities and create new applications.

12:35 p.m.

Liberal

Sean Fraser Liberal Central Nova, NS

I'm always a bit nervous when we start talking about these innovative ideas, in that in an effort to own the innovation, the government likes to run it. Is there a way to keep it in the hands of the private sector and the communities that are going to be doing the innovation?

12:35 p.m.

Co-Founder and Chair, i-Canada

Bill Hutchison

Yes. In particular, the U.K. government and even the one in the States are funding it, but these communities got together and created their own board of directors. It's somebody that the government is funding, but they're doing their own thing.

One point I like to make is that sometimes in Canada we tend to like to give a lot of money to high-tech companies—sometimes in Waterloo because it looks like a safe place to do it—but I would recommend the U.K.'s approach. They are giving the money to the cities and getting a twofer; they claim they are getting two for one. They want the cities to create demonstrator projects to have 1,000 to 2,000 people using it—not 300, and not a pilot—and they know the money is going to go to the companies, which then are well positioned to capture the export market.

The government has set a goal of trying to capture 10% of the smart cities export market. That market today is $1 trillion a year, and that's $100 billion. That's bigger than the European trade thing we're doing and bigger than what we're talking to Mr. Trump about. It's a big export market, and we're not addressing it. I wanted to throw that into the record as well.

12:35 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Judy Sgro

Thank you very much.

Monsieur Aubin.

12:35 p.m.

NDP

Robert Aubin NDP Trois-Rivières, QC

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I want to tell Mr. Fraser that his French was perfect. Maybe our problem is that we don't have a “smart” phone line.

12:35 p.m.

Voices

Oh, oh!

12:35 p.m.

Liberal

Sean Fraser Liberal Central Nova, NS

Thank you, Mr. Aubin.

February 16th, 2017 / 12:35 p.m.

NDP

Robert Aubin NDP Trois-Rivières, QC

My first question is for Mr. Miller.

It's nice to speak with a representative of a Californian company on this winter day in Canada. We appreciate it.

On a more serious note, the technology you're proposing may not be adapted for a country as large as Canada with our climate. You said earlier that 80% of the charging is done at home. I'm a typical example of someone who must travel 400 kilometres to work twice a week. Few electric vehicle models allow for this level of independence, which means we're required to stop at a charging station.

How much time do we need to charge an electric vehicle using your technology? What do you mean by “smart charging stations”?