Transport Committee on Feb. 18th, 2021

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Whatever travel measures we impose are guided by data and by the public health advice that we receive. The Minister of Public Safety, the Minister of Health and I are examining creating a system that tests essential workers. We are for sure keeping an eye on not interrupting their ability to do their jobs, because critical supplies depend on them. At the same time, we want to find a way to do it where we protect the workers, their families and Canadians. That's why we are currently in consultation with stakeholders, industry, union members and industry associations on how best to design that program.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Sidhu.

We're now going to move on to our next round.

Mr. Barsalou-Duval, you have the floor for two and a half minutes.

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Earlier, the minister suggested that I was virtually alone in defending Air Transat. Let me name a few other defenders of the company.

WestJet Airlines has spoken out against the sale. The organizations Air Passenger Rights and Flight Claim expressed concerns about the sale. The Competition Bureau and the European Commission have also expressed concerns.

Minister, as you can see, I may not be the only one defending Air Transat. If you had read the public interest review report provided to you by your department's officials, you would probably have found that there were other adverse comments about this transaction.

Air Canada is engaging in dumping by lowering prices in the regions to get rid of competition, and then takes advantage of this to raise its prices. In addition, due to the COVID-19 pandemic, Air Canada has abandoned some 30 regional routes, which is seriously affecting regional services in Quebec.

These conditions have provided an opportunity for carriers, the Quebec government and all our regional industries to think about how to work together and seek solutions to address the situation.

Regional carriers, city and airport representatives say they no longer want Air Canada in the regions because they want a healthy competitive situation with reliable carriers working for Quebec.

How can you justify the fact that the federal government is negotiating the return of Air Canada to the regions, when almost everyone thinks it's a bad idea?

Do you want to be part of the problem or the solution?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

I want to be part of the solution, for sure. I can assure my colleague that all of those factors have been taken into account. We are in a pandemic. Air traffic has been devastated. The marketplace for airlines has been devastated. Jobs have been lost. We need to do what we can to ensure that we maintain a resilient sector, that we are ready to help the sector be on guard for a recovery—

[Xavier Barsalou-Duval, Bloc, Pierre-Boucher—Les Patriotes—Verchères, QC]

Thank you. I have one last question for you.

Following the Department of Transport's refusal, NAV CANADA increased the fees it charges carriers by 30% and announced a review of the services required in all regions of Quebec. The dice were loaded because controllers received notices of termination before the review was even concluded.

Can you assure us that none of the control towers will be closed, that you will say no to NAV CANADA and that you will tell them to keep their control towers open?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

As I stated repeatedly to my other colleagues, any decision that NAV CANADA makes that will compromise or have an impact on safety will be reviewed by Transport Canada. That is my commitment to my colleagues and to all Canadians.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Mr. Alghabra, and thank you also, Mr. Barsalou-Duval.

We're now going to move on to Mr. Bachrach for two and a half minutes.

The floors is yours.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I should start by clarifying a statement from my last round. It was Air Canada that said there would be no refunds unless there was a financial assistance package. I believe I attributed it to the airline sector in general, and as we all know, WestJet has found a way to refund its passengers.

On the topic of refunds, however, I'm curious. Minister, from the very beginning, we've been pushing for your department to mandate passenger refunds, to mandate the airlines to provide those refunds to passengers who are out thousands of dollars.

Did the government pursue mandating those refunds, and did you receive specific legal advice that indicated the government was not able to force the airlines to refund passengers?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

As you know, I think it was in 2019 that we implemented air passenger protection regulations, where we clearly outlined the rights of passengers and we put a system in place whereby the Canadian Transportation Agency is able to adjudicate and look after passengers' complaints. We've set up a system where passengers can file a complaint and where airlines can be held accountable for violating the terms and the rules they should uphold.

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Minister, that process is a dumpster fire. There's a backlog of 16,000 complaints. It's totally deadlocked and no one is getting help from that process. The EU, the U.S. and the U.K. all found a way to get refunds for air passengers. Why are they so much better able to protect their air passengers' rights than Canada is?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

I take exception to my colleague's question. We have set up a system that is world class. He's right; the number of complaints have skyrocketed because of COVID. I know the agency is doing its utmost to go through them and to be as efficient as possible. Having said that, we've set up a system that protects Canadians and ensures that passengers' rights are protected. I know that in December—

[Taylor Bachrach, NDP, Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Minister, with a backlog of 16,000 complaints, are you really calling that a world-class system? I feel like I—

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Everybody knows—Canadians know—that we are in the middle of a pandemic. Canadians know there are all kinds of challenges and problems, whether it's with the airline sector or whether even.... You know, we have restrictions where people cannot visit their families. We have businesses that are suffering. We have all kinds of challenges. Our job, as a government, is to do our utmost to have the backs of Canadians and to look after them during this difficult time. We are doing everything we can to be there for Canadians.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Minister, and thank you, Mr. Bachrach.

We're now going to move on to Ms. Kusie.

Ms. Kusie, you have the floor for five minutes.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Mr. Chair, may I just say that I'm happy to take the next couple of questions, but I hope the committee forgives me. I'm already two minutes late getting to my appointment. I'll take the next couple of questions, but I hope the committee forgives me for having to leave early.

[The Chair, Liberal, Vance Badawey]

Thank you, Minister.

Ms. Kusie, go ahead.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Thank you, Chair, and thank you, Minister, for continuing to make yourself available.

Minister, for a government that has prided itself on transparency with Canadians, can you please answer why partners and airline sectors within these negotiations regarding this upcoming plan, which you've committed to, were required to sign non-disclosure agreements, leaving everyone in the dark as to what we can expect and when we can expect it?

Can you comment on that, please?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Canadians know that negotiations involve disclosure of financial information, disclosure and discussions about various options, and Canadians will know that I'm not able.... If I say something now and then the negotiations end up taking another turn, that will end up causing misinformation among Canadians.

I think my colleague understands why I don't have the ability to talk about the machinations of the negotiations that are taking place, and I think my colleague knows why they need to be confidential until they're completed.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

My colleague mentioned previously that when the pandemic is over, or finally, we hope, the government is successful in its vaccination efforts or perhaps in utilizing the tools of vaccines and rapid testing, which we have been encouraging the government to do for so long, even then, when the airline sector opens again, there will have been an incredible loss of market share over this time. I've mentioned this in the House. We see it, for example, with the implementation of the travel restrictions, whereby American carriers can still fly Canadians to sun destinations.

Will this plan include a strategy for dealing with the loss of market share, which will take years for the Canadian airline sector to recover?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Let me just correct the record. No American airlines can take Canadians to a sun destination. If they do, then those Canadians are buying multiple tickets to get to the sun destination. There are no direct flights between Canada and sun destinations.

Having said that, the short answer to her question is yes. We are committed to working with the airline sector and making sure that they are strong and ready for a recovery post-COVID.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Excellent.

When the pandemic passes as a result of the vaccines—which we genuinely hope are procured and distributed soon, and which so many Canadians have been waiting for—and Canadians are finally able to go on that vacation to visit their families whom they haven't seen in so long or to take some time together as families or friends when this is all over, there will be such incredible demand and yet such a lack of supply, as a result of this government's inability to support the airline sector to maintain a certain level of service.

We'll see so many Canadians who want to go on these trips, yet the price of tickets, as a result of lack of supply, will be sky-high. Is the government willing to accept responsibility at that time for not having intervened sooner, rather than allowing airlines and airport authorities to take the hit at a time when Canadians again are willing to travel but will have to pay so much more as a result of this government's long-standing inaction?

Will the government take responsibility at that time?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

I think that's more a statement than a question, and I disagree with her premise.

Let me repeat what I said. We are committed to working with the airline sector and making sure that we have strong and resilient airlines. We are committed to working with the airline sector on a plan through the recovery whereby, we think, some measures will still be in place, but we want to make sure that airlines and passengers are able to travel and operate safely.

Yes, our commitment to the sector is solid.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Further to that, Minister—thank you—on January 29 the Prime Minister stated that he was committed to the safe restart of the travel and tourism sector and to working on the relationship with testing and quarantine. Of course, I'm from Alberta, where we have the successful YYC pilot project, which I think would have been far easier to implement at international arrivals across the country, rather than go through the process of the three-day quarantine.

Minister, what actions have you and your colleagues taken relative to testing and quarantine specifically for the safe restart of the travel and tourism sector?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

The best way for us to recover is by defeating COVID. That is the best and most effective plan, and that's why our government is focused on ensuring vaccine supplies for all Canadians who want to be vaccinated. That's why we are imposing difficult but necessary travel measures to protect against the importation of infection and the new variants. That's why we're guided by public health advice throughout this process.

I don't personally take any joy in these difficult decisions, but they are necessary. This is what true leadership means. It means making tough decisions.

[Stephanie Kusie, Conservative, Calgary Midnapore, AB]

Leadership, Minister, would have been implementing rapid testing and testing on arrival, so that these drastic measures weren't required, but I certainly hope you will have more success than your predecessor.

Thank you, Minister, and thank you, Chair.