Transport Committee on March 21st, 2024

[Leslyn Lewis, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Fraser. I'm not trying to interrupt you. I'm just trying to focus on this very specific concern that Canadians have.

[Sean Fraser, Liberal, Central Nova, NS]

I appreciate that. Thank you, Dr. Lewis.

[Leslyn Lewis, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Your Liberal government is increasing the carbon tax by 23% on April 1. Isn't that tax revenue supposed to be enough to fund climate change? Why do you need to cut back on funding new roads?

[Sean Fraser, Liberal, Central Nova, NS]

The policy you're referring to doesn't generate new revenue, because all of the money is returned to the jurisdiction in which it's collected to go directly to households to leave eight out of 10 families across the country better off as a result of the rebate they receive.

There is no revenue from that policy for the government to use for infrastructure.

[Leslyn Lewis, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Well, the Parliamentary Budget Officer differs and says it is not a revenue-neutral policy.

However, I will continue with the line of questioning.

How much time do I have?

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

You have 50 seconds, Dr. Lewis.

[Leslyn Lewis, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Another question is this: Why do you need more money from this new road policy in order to fight climate change if you have the 23% increase on the carbon tax? We know that it's not revenue-neutral. People are not getting back as much as they're paying out.

It's easy to conclude that your Liberal government is increasing the carbon tax by 23% on Canadians who cannot afford food and who are going to food banks. Now this same government wants them to give up their cars. Isn't that a fact, Mr. Fraser?

[Sean Fraser, Liberal, Central Nova, NS]

No. The question contained a number of points that were not based in fact.

For example, there is no such policy as you've referred to. None of the carbon pricing funding goes towards revenue for the government. In fact, the people you seem to be genuinely concerned about are the very families who are left better off as a result of the policy, according to the same Parliamentary Budget Officer that you referenced.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you very much, Minister. Thank you, Dr. Lewis.

I received a message from interpretation that they will not be able to provide interpretation if we have talkover. To all members asking questions, I know we're trying to get as many questions in as we can, but it's very difficult for them to be able to do their jobs if we are talking over each other.

Next we will go to Mr. Rogers.

[Leslyn Lewis, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

You're very welcome, Dr. Lewis.

Mr. Rogers, you have six minutes, please.

[Churence Rogers, Liberal, Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, NL]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, Minister Fraser and Ms. Gillis, for being here with us today.

First off, Minister, to clarify and reiterate, can you please confirm with the committee what this government's policy is on roads?

[Sean Fraser, Liberal, Central Nova, NS]

We fund roads.

[Churence Rogers, Liberal, Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, NL]

That's pretty clear.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh!

[Churence Rogers, Liberal, Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, NL]

Thank you, Mr. Minister.

[Sean Fraser, Liberal, Central Nova, NS]

No further questions.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh!

[Churence Rogers, Liberal, Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, NL]

There are further questions, yes.

I want to highlight—because I'm so proud of this—a recent announcement made in Newfoundland and Labrador that stands in stark contrast to what the opposition's pushing for today.

Last week Minister Hutchings, on your behalf, announced over $15 million in federal funding dollars for 31 different highways and road projects across the province. This includes projects in my riding of Bonavista—Burin—Trinity in towns like Marystown, Grand Bank, Musgravetown and Bonavista.

Just last year, your predecessor announced $153 million towards a $300-million Trans-Canada Highway twinning project that will see highway expansions, including over 40 kilometres past Whitbourne in my riding going west towards Port aux Basques. That's pretty exciting for me as a member of Parliament for the riding of Bonavista—Burin—Trinity. That sure sounds like a great road-building policy to me.

Can you elaborate on these announcements and how similar announcements are happening across Canada?

[Sean Fraser, Liberal, Central Nova, NS]

Look, thanks very much for the question, Churence.

Putting $150 million towards the twinning of the Trans-Canada Highway in Newfoundland is a big deal. The announcement you referred to in the opening to your question, which was putting millions of dollars into the community to help build road infrastructure—that is also a big deal.

Newfoundland and Labrador, through the Canada community-building fund, to date has had municipalities use about $50 million towards road building in your province since we've been in government. It's important that we understand the impact this has on communities, particularly on rural communities.

I'm a rural MP. I live in a small town, but I have a riding of about 10,000 square kilometres. Road-building projects put people to work and can improve highway safety and can improve connectivity between communities.

To some of the points that Dr. Lewis made during her intervention, we have significantly stepped up transit infrastructure around buses, public transit and active transportation, disproportionately in urban environments. For people like you and me in communities like yours and mine, the impact of investing in road infrastructure improves the efficacy of travel and safety for the general public, and the economic activity it generates is a positive thing, in my view, and in the view of the government.

To answer your question, we've now invested hundreds of millions of dollars in Newfoundland and Labrador alone. That's putting people to work to build out roads, to help grow the economy and to improve the quality of safety on our highways.

[Churence Rogers, Liberal, Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, NL]

Taking that further, you just alluded to municipal road projects, but I know for a fact that in Newfoundland and Labrador over the last number of years, we've been investing in what we call “trunk roads”, which are major highways that intersect with the Trans-Canada Highway and others, and also with many of the municipalities that these roads pass through.

Also, within the municipalities, we've been investing in major road improvements in many towns, which is great for these small rural towns. Without the federal government participation, these projects wouldn't happen. The province wouldn't have the capacity, and certainly the municipalities would not have the capacity.

Can you talk about municipal infrastructure projects, particularly about some of the key investment supports provided?

[Sean Fraser, Liberal, Central Nova, NS]

Certainly, and I agree with your assertion altogether that some of these major projects, particularly on these bigger highway investments you're referring to, don't happen without significant investments by the federal government.

I mentioned during a previous answer my own community benefiting from the twinning of 37 kilometres of highway between Sutherland's River and Antigonish. That is helping to improve safety on what was the most deadly stretch of highway in my province, but within municipalities, when you look at the extraordinary cost of investing in infrastructure, you can see that clearly that they need support as well.

One of the things that sometimes gets lost in the mix is that even the decisions taken by municipal governments to fund roads are sometimes using federal resources. On the municipal projects I was pointing to, in Newfoundland, 391 different projects were funded by the federal government through decisions taken by municipalities through the Canada community-building fund. Literally, in your province alone, hundreds of road projects have benefited from federal funding. It makes an important difference, not just for those major highway expansions you're referring to but also for transportation, particularly in smaller communities in Newfoundland and Labrador, and in fact in every jurisdiction in the country.

[Churence Rogers, Liberal, Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, NL]

Yes, and I referred earlier to the 40 kilometres in my riding, but there's also a 15-kilometre stretch of the Trans-Canada in the Coast of Bays region that is being funded, near the town of Grand Falls-Windsor and some other nearby towns. More importantly, on the improvements in the highway from Port aux Basques coming east, to fix the horrendous road that's there and that bottlenecks in the traffic that comes from the ferry from Nova Scotia, that's a major improvement that will happen. It will be extremely important for safety reasons as well.

[Sean Fraser, Liberal, Central Nova, NS]

There's no question, but I can't help but feel that you took a shot at Nova Scotia in blaming us for the potholes.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh!