Transport Committee on Oct. 1st, 2024

[Susan Wright]

Lighting isn't an issue for us. The biggest thing is longer, paved runways, which will allow us to take more people, essentially.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you very much, Ms. Idlout, and thank you, Ms. Wright.

Next we'll go to Mr. Vis. The floor is yours for five minutes.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Before I go forward with some questions, I just want to give notice of the motion that I referenced at our in camera meeting last week. This will be distributed after I read it out.

The motion is as follows:

That given every major road and trade route in British Columbia experienced major disruptions due to natural disasters in 2021, the Standing Committee on Transport, Infrastructure and Communities (TRAN) undertake a study of the 2021 floods, landslides and wildfires in British Columbia, their impacts on supply chains, critical road, rail and port infrastructure, and review the government’s response to the disaster and supply chain resiliency. This study should allow for a call of written submissions, consist of no less than six (6) meetings and hear from the following witnesses:

a. Vancouver Fraser Port Authority;

b. Canadian National, Southern Railway of British Columbia, and Canadian Pacific Kansas City railways;

c. Ashcroft Terminal;

d. Mayor of the City of Abbotsford;

e. Various small businesses;

f. The National Supply Chain Office;

g. BC Ministry of Transportation and Infrastructure;

h. Department officials from Public Safety Canada; Housing, Infrastructure and Communities Canada; Transport Canada; National Defence; and Pacific Economic Development Canada; and

that the committee report its findings and recommendations to the House.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you, Mr. Vis.

I'll start your clock for your line of questioning.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Thank you.

Ms. Wright, I flew once in my life in northern Canada, when I went from Iqaluit to Kimmirut in the previous member's riding. I was incredibly amazed at the skill of our pilots, but also quite scared about the gravel runway and the impact I felt when we landed.

Thank you for sharing and giving voice to the northern infrastructure and the way that people move around in more than half of our country.

You mentioned the challenges you face with fuel. Can you provide this committee with a breakdown of what an operator in the Northwest Territories, or any of the territories, pays for fuel?

By that I mean what proportion goes to the carbon tax, what proportion goes to other federal taxes, and what proportion goes to territorial taxes and other taxes that you as an operator may be subject to.

[Susan Wright]

Thank you for that. I don't have those numbers available, but I remember that in previous years we had expected fuel to be about 30% of every flight or every charter we would take. I'd be more than willing to get you that information.

Essentially, these gravel runways—I'm glad you've had the experience to be on one—are not overly pleasant. They also do restrict a lot of movement.

Looking into where we are situated, we are in Norman Wells. This is a regional centre in the Northwest Territories located right on the Mackenzie River. In this town alone, we've suffered from historically low water on the Mackenzie River. It affects all our supplies and all our parts for our planes. It includes everything we need to operate as an airline, including the fuel that is supplied into this town to offer this service that supports the whole region. That water is so low that the barge can't travel. This is our second year when we've had to have fuel flown in.

We were just advised that we are expecting a $3.50 increase to our heating fuel, per litre, coming up here. I think they have 30 or 40 different flights coming in that are supplying us with fuel. That will be on the backs of us and the paying consumer.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Okay—

[Susan Wright]

This will change a lot.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

So taxes and levies absolutely have an impact on the ability of the residents you serve to travel and also to heat their homes. You're saying that this next winter will be really tough.

[Susan Wright]

Yes. I would say that taxes and levies will be extremely crippling—

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Okay—

[Susan Wright]

—and there's nothing that we can do as an airline to avoid that, because we can't be a fuel supplier as well. We're an airline. We're not a fuel supplier.

We are expecting a lot of things to kind of get out of hand this fall.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Thank you.

In your opening statement, you talked about the challenge of keeping pace with the number of regulations you face. I believe one other committee member covered the flight and duty regulations, but you touched upon pay equity. Why has pay equity been a challenge for your company?

[Susan Wright]

Pay equity actually hasn't been a challenge for our company. The point I was trying to get at was that small airlines like ours exist in Canada. It's not all just WestJet and Air Canada, who have huge corporate offices and a lot of resources out there; there are a lot of small operators in the north who are doing a very good job in terms of working to connect Canadians. These companies, like ours, have a hard time handling all the regulatory reform. It's not—

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Let's stop right there, at regulatory reform.

Are you stating that the regulations coming from Transport Canada are designed in a way that reflects the need to regulate the larger airlines in Canada, and they don't reflect the nuances of small operators in northern Canada?

[Susan Wright]

That's something that has been continuously mentioned. The flight and duty regulations in particular were not written for the north and do not provide an opportunity for northern operators to do the work they need to do with respect to their goals under the flight and duty regulations, but the—

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

I'm sorry. I'm running out of time.

In my remaining time, what would you recommend to this committee to change in respect to that regulation you just referred to in order to make it more equitable for northern and rural operators such as yours?

[Susan Wright]

Pilots need to be able to fly longer hours, I believe. I believe the regulations need to be written for the north. They need to work with the Northern Air Transport Association to be able to find a solution.

Honestly, just send out regulations at a pace that is achievable for small northern airlines to keep up with. Keep them to scale of what the size of the company is. Just recognize that burden.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

To reiterate, your recommendation is to keep our regulations to scale to reflect the nuances of northern operators. Is that correct?

[Susan Wright]

Exactly. That's correct.

[Brad Vis, Conservative, Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Peter Schiefke]

Thank you very much, Mr. Vis.

Thanks, Ms. Wright.

Mr. Rogers, the floor is yours. You have five minutes, please.

[Churence Rogers, Liberal, Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, NL]

Thank you, Chair, and thank you to the witnesses today.

Of course, we all know as we travel across the country that living in rural Canada is a real challenge. When we started this study, we talked about how maybe more competition from different airlines, or less competition from giant airlines like Air Canada and WestJet and so on, might be something that we would need in order to see some reduction in airfares and perhaps better service.

Obviously, you know, Ms. Wright, in northern Canada we see the same challenges where you live as in my province of Newfoundland and Labrador. We know that the military airports that were built by the Americans, like Goose Bay, Stephenville, Gander and others, were divested back in the 1990s, and they're struggling to survive.

Economies of scale and location of airports obviously are major factors in terms of being able to be competitive and to keep costs at a minimum for the people who use the services.

I'll come back to you, Ms. Wright.

Mr. Paradis, in your situation, you talked about how people drive to Montreal, Quebec City, and so on. Can you speak to how you try to collaborate with partners, other industries, or organizations to promote travel in your region in order to minimize costs or to try to improve services for the people you serve?

[Bruno Paradis]

Thanks to the member for that question.

We're now consulting economic development organizations, chambers of commerce and all the businesses in our regions on the approach we've taken regarding the airport. We're also consulting organizations in the health system, which we call the integrated health and social services centres, the region's university and the various educational institutions that have needs in our area. All these stakeholders are currently represented on the committee. We're also speaking with representatives of the provincial departments. Our objective is to pool all air transport needs in the region and form as clear a picture of the situation as possible.

We have also communicated with one carrier to see if it would be possible to offer the service. Many of the private businesses needed flights to Toronto, for example, for contracts in the greater Toronto area. So we contacted all businesses, various service organizations and government organizations. Our objective is to establish a clear picture of the situation.

We're working with the Quebec government to establish a program or introduce a route with an air carrier in the medium or long term.

[Churence Rogers, Liberal, Bonavista—Burin—Trinity, NL]

Would trying to entice or invite other competitive airlines to fly into your airport make any sense?