First of all, thank you to all four of you for coming today. I appreciate it.
Monsieur Tousignant, I don't know if you had a chance to read the testimony from the last hearing, sir, but we had Roddie O'Handley here, a medically released RCMP officer.
I'm going to give you the scenario of two people. As you know, Bill C-201 would end the benefit reduction at 65. It would end the CPP disability reduction as well.
Roddie O'Handley was medically released from the RCMP. At the time, he got 64% of his RCMP pension. Great-West Life topped it up by 11%, to 75%. After two years, Great-West Life said that's it, we're done; you should be applying for CPP disability. He did so, and he received it, an amount of over $16,000.
The first call he gets is from the RCMP annuity branch: you owe us $11,000. He had to pay all that back.
The second call he's going to get is from Great-West Life. They are going to ask for over $8,000.
Mr. O'Handley received $16,000 from CPP disability and will owe $19,000. He will owe, because of his disability, $3,000 more.
On top of that, when he hits 65, CPP disability will stop. We heard testimony from previous witnesses that he'll lose even more money at age 65.
This happened to him and to Jim Hill. It also happens to members of the military and everything else.
I just ask you one simple question. Is it fair to these men and women who serve in the RCMP and the military that because they're disabled they will lose money on the payback and then, at age 65, will lose money again? Is that at all fair?
Second, you had indicated, Madam, that there are people who advise the minister on these very pensions. A few years ago, the pension was changed from 20 years of service to 25 years.
May I ask who suggested that to the government at the time? Why was it done? Were the pensions in trouble? Did they have to be increased in this regard? If not, then why was that changed?
Also, what was the additional cost to the membership for having that change in there?
This is for new hires of the military. Those who were there before were grandfathered at 20 years, but anyone joining now would have to wait 25 years.
Those are my questions.
Again, I thank you all very much for coming.