Veterans Affairs Committee on Oct. 16th, 2018

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

There are other things happening, in addition to the rangers, which may involve indigenous veterans.

We have the base at Alert. There is a new base being completed, a summer sailing type of base at Nanisivik, I believe. I'm wondering if you had many encounters with those folks, who are in roughly the same territory as the rangers, on their unique issues.

My sister was posted in Alert back in 1980. She was one of the first women to go up there. She didn't talk too much about it, so I don't really know what the depth of her experience was.

Do you hear, in your office, issues from those Far North postings, in addition to the rangers' issues that we're involved in?

[Gary Walbourne]

Not a lot. We haven't had much to do with something that far remote. Those are very specific term positions that people are in. They know what the task is going in. I think they are well prepared going in, so we've never had any complaints, specifically, from that group.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

The issue that's growing is the work that the Russians are doing in their own Arctic. They have brigades of soldiers north of the Arctic Circle. They have a fairly substantial population there, and we have the rangers.

I'm wondering if they feel pressure on the lack of resources in view of things like climate change, a potential Russian threat and so on. Do they talk about their role in a very important part of Canada and the amount of resources that they're able to bring to it? Are they fairly content with what they're doing and the way they're doing it?

[Gary Walbourne]

There's always a resourcing issue. Let's look at the exchange of the rifles. For the rangers, that is something they've wanted to see happen much more quickly than it has happened. I know they've started, and I understand there's a process behind everything. However, even with the issuance of the hoodies, for them, there was a time when there was a shortage and a few people in that patrol group didn't have one. That was a real issue, because again it's a sense of pride and position.

As for the rest of it, for pay grades, that's far above my head.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

Okay.

What about the question of open-ended service, for rangers in their sixties, and so on? Are they able to access veterans benefits even though they haven't formally signed off, or should they? Is there a way that we can resolve that specific issue?

[Gary Walbourne]

No, that mechanism exists today. We have serving members of the Canadian Armed Forces who are also clients of Veterans Affairs Canada. The last number I heard was somewhere around 8,000 to 10,000 members. That mechanism is in place.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

That's interesting for those folks, because they tend not to have resources nearby as it is. Then I'm thinking, after many years of service and the type of wear and tear that happens on the body and the psyche, if they're not able to get what we would call normal service and now there's a specialized concern because of their advancing age, weariness and so on, are there ways to get them those services?

By the way, the report is excellent. I'm asking some of these esoteric questions because we can take right out of these words that you've written angles for us to come up with recommendations.

I wonder as well about the other aspects of their lives as veterans in the Far North, the rangers themselves. Have you been able to conjure up a way that services could be delivered more meaningfully? I know it's resources, but are there mobile units? What could we do for them?

[Gary Walbourne]

Any and all of those things are possible. One thing we're going to have to wrap our minds around is that we have a constituency base for which we are responsible and they're not coming to us, so it's incumbent on us to go to them. There is no other option.

As I said, when the nearest Wi-Fi hotspot is 1,000 kilometres away, you're not going to get many emails or get online to fill out your forms. If we intend to increase the number of rangers and have a presence in the north, and if they can't get to us, then it's our job to go to them.

[Bob Bratina, Liberal, Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, ON]

Thanks very much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Neil Ellis]

Thank you.

Mr. Samson.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Thank you, Chair, and to all of you, thank you for being here.

Mr. Walbourne, I want to thank you, as my colleague did, for your service and your hard work and dedication. With your history, of course, and experience coming into the job and now leaving, you would make for a good book to read someday. I just want to throw that at you.

I have a number of questions. Some of the key things you mentioned are so crucial, such as knowledge of the land. You can't buy that. To some extent, you almost can't teach it unless you come from there. I get caught up when in the north they refer to “the south”, that we're all in the south. They feel that they're quite a distance away.

We as a country, and as government, have shown much more interest in the north. The need for rangers is probably higher every day. We do recommend other regions where we could be, where we could have stations and whatnot. I don't know how many stations are out there right now, where we have a main station and then they feed off. Is there an area, or are there more places that now, in the last 10 years, we could have a home base so that we get closer to them and reach a greater number?

[Gary Walbourne]

That is definitely outside my purview of authority. I'm sure that will be a decision made by the Government of Canada, where it wants to put patrol groups.

However, let's consider that as we do position patrol groups. How are we going to get access to them? What will be that exchange of information to the member and back to the centre? How does that look? Can we define that first before we go in, all guns ablazing? Can't we just figure out what we want to do in order to make sure we have that connectivity to the community?

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Do they have VAC accounts? It might be a silly question, but I know access is difficult. Do they have access in some way, shape or form?

They receive their cheques. Whichever way they receive their cheques, can they receive benefits and information about the benefits? Is there a way we can ensure that they have access to the knowledge and to the information?

[Gary Walbourne]

Some of it is going to take infrastructure, for sure, bricks and mortar maybe in some places. Most communities do not have a bank. Some will have the community store. One of the local northern chains would be in there. They'll cash a cheque.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

If they would pick up a cheque there, would they not be able to pick up information about the services and the benefits? Are we reaching them? They have to go pick up their cheque. Are we trying to get the info to them through that venue?

[Gary Walbourne]

I don't know if those particular avenues are being followed today. Maybe it's an opportunity, but again, that would only be part of a solution. We can't let that go to an outside entity when it's our responsibility.

I'll go back to it and I'll stay on it. If the Canadian ranger instructor group were large enough, then they could be on the ground. It's their responsibility to tell the members what the Canadian Armed Forces health care benefits are, and their entitlements.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Were you able to take a peek at the recruitment process for both instructors and rangers? Is there an active plan to recruit more now, and to replace those?

[Gary Walbourne]

I know the intent is to increase the size of the rangers, the entity in itself, to make it larger than it is. There are active campaigns going on. The chief of the defence staff has said he is going to increase the rangers, and all five CRPGs are engaged in one way or another. I don't know their specific plans, but I am sure.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

How many rangers are out there?

[Gary Walbourne]

There are 5,000 in total.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Are we tracking them? Do we know everything about them?

[Gary Walbourne]

No.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

We pay them. We should know what they're doing and where they are. We should know their ages and their challenges.

[Gary Walbourne]

If we're paying them for having performed a function, we know what the function was and what they were doing. Again, class A is 12 days a year and class B can be more or less than 180 days. It depends on the contract of service they're on, what they're doing and that type of thing.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

I read somewhere that they don't want to report, and somebody already touched on that. They don't like to report because of fear they might not get a contract or their time's up or whatnot. Both of you were in there more often. Do you have any comments on that?