Evidence of meeting #97 for Veterans Affairs in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was community.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4:35 p.m.
NDP
Gord Johns NDP Courtenay—Alberni, BC
I will follow up with Mr. Chen's question. We heard testimony from Professor Lackenbauer. He raised the possibility that some Canadian rangers wouldn't be eligible for certain programs under Veterans Affairs Canada.
Can you clarify if Canadian rangers are eligible for the last resort financial assistance provided through the Canadian Forces income support or the veterans emergency fund?
4:35 p.m.
Ombudsman, National Defence and Canadian Forces Ombudsman
I'm not sure. I'm sorry.
4:35 p.m.
NDP
Gord Johns NDP Courtenay—Alberni, BC
Do you know if they are eligible for the education and training benefit?
4:35 p.m.
Ombudsman, National Defence and Canadian Forces Ombudsman
As I say, depending on the type of contract they are engaged on—class A, B, C reservists—I would assume they are considered part of the reserve so they would be eligible for the same types of benefits.
4:35 p.m.
NDP
Gord Johns NDP Courtenay—Alberni, BC
Ms. Wagantall talked earlier about the ratio of instructors to rangers. Is there a recommended ratio you think we should get to?
4:35 p.m.
Ombudsman, National Defence and Canadian Forces Ombudsman
As I said earlier, I think it's going to depend on proximity, operational tempo, the pace. I think those are all going to be deciding factors. I wouldn't step in that lane. I think it's best left for those who work the ground every day to determine what those ratios should be.
4:35 p.m.
NDP
Gord Johns NDP Courtenay—Alberni, BC
How do you think we should proceed in doing that? Every region is very different, especially north of 60.
4:35 p.m.
Ombudsman, National Defence and Canadian Forces Ombudsman
I think the first thing we need to start doing is make sure our Canadian ranger instructors are well resourced and they have the ability to get out and take the time to determine what that looks like. It's a job for the chain of command for sure.
4:35 p.m.
NDP
Gord Johns NDP Courtenay—Alberni, BC
Members of the rangers are paid on a 12 days per year basis, which is one day a month. How has this workload been established, and what is the average pay for a ranger's day of work? Are you aware?
4:35 p.m.
Ombudsman, National Defence and Canadian Forces Ombudsman
That's a class A reserve type of contract. It's a minimum attendance, 12 times a year. Then there are other rangers who will be on class B, less than 180 days, and class B, greater than 180 days.
As for the pay, Robyn....
October 16th, 2018 / 4:35 p.m.
Director General, Operations, National Defence and Canadian Forces Ombudsman
The pay depends because there are different ranks within the Canadian rangers as well, but we can provide you with the pay scales of the different ranks afterwards, if that's helpful for you.
4:35 p.m.
NDP
Gord Johns NDP Courtenay—Alberni, BC
I know you're going to get a couple of minutes to address us at the end, but is there anything you want to add specifically regarding indigenous veterans? You have 30 seconds probably.
4:35 p.m.
Ombudsman, National Defence and Canadian Forces Ombudsman
I think I've said it all.
My caution again is let's make sure we're listening. Let's make sure we don't look at the storefront. Let's go in through the door. Let's talk to people on the ground.
All our information came from actual rangers sitting in a circle, talking to them, and spending time with them. Ski-Doo rides in the middle of winter in Behchoko are a real treat. Ask Robyn. I volunteered her for that. I rode back in a warm van.
Let's not rush through this and put some sugar-coating on it. Let's get on the ground. Let's get the ground crew and find out exactly what the sticking points are, and then make sure we resource it properly. That would be my recommendation to the committee.
4:35 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Neil Ellis
Thank you.
That ends the time for our testimony today. On behalf of the committee, I'd like to thank you for all you have done for the committee over probably your four to five times being in front of us.
I will turn the floor over to you. You said you would like a minute at the end.
The floor is yours.
4:35 p.m.
Ombudsman, National Defence and Canadian Forces Ombudsman
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Ladies and gentlemen, as many of you are aware, I've decided to retire from this position as of October 31 of this year. The reasons for this departure are both personal and professional. Therefore, this will likely be the last time I appear before this committee or any parliamentary committee for that mater. Sorry about the smile.
I am proud of the work this office has done over my four and a half years as ombudsman. During this time, we have published 14 reports, as well as a comprehensive submission to the Minister of National Defence on the defence policy review.
Our office has made a difference. Our recommendations are well reflected in “Strong, Secure, Engaged” and in recommendations that your committee and other parliamentary committees have made over that time. Many of the recommendations have been implemented and over time, I'm confident that more will be. I stand behind all of the recommendations I've made over my four and a half years and I am confident that, right now, they are the best way forward.
As I have said quite publicly, some have not been implemented, based on personalities rather than practicality, and this is sad. The second that we let personalities interfere with what is right for those who wear the uniform in service to Canada, we lose the plot.
As I have stated in my farewell message, I have pushed as hard as I can and as hard as I think the system can take. The Department of National Defence and the Canadian Armed Forces have my recommendations. They know which ones are implemented and which ones aren't. If personalities are set aside, we'll know what to do with them and the defence community will be better for it. In the end—and I know we will end up where we need to be—the interim years of inaction and a lack of implementation will mean more heartache for our members. Eventually, we will get there. We have no choice.
I remind the incoming ombudsperson, whether that person is acting in this position on an interim basis or is appointed through the regular Governor in Council process, that this is not a popularity contest. Follow the evidence and trust no one. As an office of last resort, when people get to us, it's because they've already been severely chafed by the system and have nowhere else to turn. Impartiality, confidentiality and objectivity are the core tenets of my responsibilities. They are not to be taken lightly and your actions will be observed and judged accordingly. Accountability starts and ends at the top.
Finally and most importantly, I am incredibly proud of the 65 public servants of this office, who serve the defence community on a daily basis. We have members who have been on our team since we turned on the lights 20 years ago this year. They're professional, respectful and devoted to the work they do on a daily basis. I am in awe of their ability to focus on the task at hand and do it with a grace and humility scarcely matched anywhere else in government. To them, I say thank you for everything.
Ladies and gentlemen, thank you very much.
4:40 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Neil Ellis
Some pictures need to be taken, so we'll recess for five minutes and then come back in camera for some committee business.
[Proceedings continue in camera]