Veterans Affairs Committee on May 6th, 2022

[Steven Harris]

The mental health benefit will allow people to access treatment for mental health immediately upon application. In the past, people had to wait for a decision to come from Veterans Affairs. As we've spoken about, sometimes those decisions take too long. We recognize that immediate access to mental health is important. Any time spent waiting for mental health approaches, services or treatment can be too long and allows for somebody to get worse, frankly, in terms of their mental health. This will allow people, upon application, to immediately access mental health treatment. While that decision is being made, they'll still be able to access treatment to ensure that their conditions are being treated immediately.

[Rechie Valdez, Liberal, Mississauga—Streetsville, ON]

Thanks for answering the spectrum.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Thank you, Ms. Valdez.

Mr. Desilets, the floor is now yours for two and a half minutes.

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

My question is for Ms. Meunier or Mr. Harris.

The Department of Veterans Affairs is not really the most visible or the most appealing, but it is one of the only ones working directly with human beings, human beings who are often having trouble. We can't be indifferent to that.

We all know that the case managers are doing everything they can, and we understand that they are snowed under. However, the human beings we're talking about need support and they need tools and guidance. A few months ago, a witness presented us with the idea of creating liaison officer positions. Their role would be to help veterans and connect them with the case managers. They would help veterans to understand where they stand, what they have to do, what stage their case is at, and so on.

I would like to get your opinion on that.

Might creating that kind of position be useful? Could this liaison officer play a supplemental role?

[Steven Harris]

Thank you for the question.

I think the officers currently working in veteran services already play that role to some degree. It may not be as defined as the liaison officer role you described, but I think this kind of role exists in various areas in the department.

We are always on the lookout for any new idea that could help us support veterans and offer them the best possible service. If there is another way of providing services, we would like to consider it.

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you.

We have received some information relating to commemoration activities over the summer.

Is something being planned?

We are in the process of planning our vacation.

[Amy Meunier]

With regard to commemoration, we are always planning. Of course, we are coming upon the 80th anniversary of Dieppe in August.

We're also looking to commemorate and recognize more peacetime or modern operations. We're looking at activities to recognize the Red River flood. We have a variety of activities. We do keep an up-to-date calendar on our website, and we'd be happy to keep you informed of larger events and activities happening throughout your region and across the country.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Thank you, Ms. Meunier.

Mr. Desilets, your speaking time is up.

Ms. Blaney, the floor is yours for two and a half minutes.

[Rachel Blaney, NDP, North Island—Powell River, BC]

Thank you, Chair.

I want to start off by saying that I disagree with Ms. Meunier. I want to point out to everybody at this table that, in fact, in 2015 and 2017, the letter to the Minister of Veterans Affairs from the Prime Minister said directly to address this issue, and then it disappeared. I'm not going to allow it to disappear.

I also want to point out that VAC does in fact oversee both the OSB and the pension clause, so I understand that there are multiple ministries that are involved in this, but the fact that so many veterans across this country who have served our country and so many RCMP who have served our country worry about their partners being able to live in the same house when they die is unacceptable.

This question is for Mr. Harris.

The veterans survivor pension does not in fact apply to RCMP officers, and those veterans do fall under the minister's mandate. What is VAC doing to accommodate the needs of survivors of the RCMP veterans?

[Steven Harris]

Well, there are survivor pensions, so when we speak of pensions that are in place to support disabilities that have been received as a result of their service, whether that is with the RCMP or whether that's through service with the Canadian Armed Forces, there are benefits for survivors that apply in that instance. I think that's.... Survivors and dependants can receive benefits as a result of that.

[Rachel Blaney, NDP, North Island—Powell River, BC]

I'm talking about survivor benefits, so I will say that at this point there is not anything for RCMP. In fact, in my conversations with the amazing veterans from the RCMP, who do tremendous work in fundraising to support women who have been left—largely women—who have lost their husbands and now have very little.... I just want to point out as well that we had a conversation...and more are coming. I just want to say that my office is inundated with these stories, and when I hear these stories, I just know that it's an injustice. That is my job: to voice that.

I think of Norma, who presented to us and who will be looking after her granddaughter who has special needs. When he passes, she will be living on significantly less, so part of their plan is how they're going to face those challenges.

I just want to correct the record, that there are not the supports for the RCMP who retire and that there are supports for the veterans. There's a huge gap there and it is absolutely under this department to fix it, and I certainly hope you do.

[Steven Harris]

I do apologize about my having misspoke about the RCMP.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

There are 10 seconds left.

[Rachel Blaney, NDP, North Island—Powell River, BC]

I think that's good for me.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Thank you, Ms. Blaney.

Let's go back to Mr. Frank Caputo for five minutes, please.

[Frank Caputo, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Thank you, Chair. I'll be giving my time to MP Wagantall.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Okay.

Mrs. Wagantall, you have five minutes. Please go ahead.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I really appreciate the feedback I'm getting today on this benefits navigator online program.

I want to clarify something. Mr. Harris, you indicated that downtime has been very minimal and it's whenever there needs to be changes to what is offered on there. I would appreciate it if I could get a log of those downtimes and the reason for each of them, not going into great detail about whatever change was made, but so that we have clarity.

The timeline isn't making sense to me. From what I've heard from veterans who are directly involved with it, it came about when the court case around the new veterans charter with the Afghan veterans was put in abeyance before the 2015 election. This was part of the agreement with all of that, and this program went live online in 2016.

I'm not sure if we're comparing the same thing at this point. If we could get clarity on that, I would really appreciate it if you could bring that to committee.

I appreciate that these tools are there, and I think they're really important. However, if there's no follow-up to get any sense of when a veteran goes through this process and sees that they think these are things they would qualify for and then they don't.... There would need to be changes made, I would think, to make that clearer to them when they're applying. It's one thing for a program to say, “This is something you deserve,” and there's the other side of that whole coin, which you guys have to deal with, and that is getting the proof required from those veterans.

I've heard a lot about benefit of the doubt and how much more it's being applied now than it was in the past, specifically because of the backlogs. Is there any way of monitoring that as well? Say someone lifts 100 pounds of gas in multiple containers onto a truck over and over again, and has back injuries, but they have no proof of that. They were a reservist at 16, 17 or 18 years old, and now they're hitting their late seventies or eighties.

How is that being implemented in our programs at VAC to improve the way we're treating our veterans in their circumstances?

Ms. Meunier, did you want to respond?

[Amy Meunier]

I'm happy to, if my colleague is all right with that.

[Steven Harris]

Sure. Go ahead.

[Amy Meunier]

We certainly take that into account now. You talked about the benefit of doubt, which is a principle laid out in our legislation and regulation. What you're talking about is how we use the evidence that someone may experience by virtue of their repetitive job or the nature of their work over a period of time. We have tools, which we refer to as entitlement eligibility guidelines. That is precisely what they do. They take positions or military occupations and the physical or mental elements connected to that type of trade over periods of time, whether it's five or 10 years. Our officers are able to use those.

You gave a great example. For someone carrying a rucksack, a paratrooper jumping or parachuting for 20 years, these injuries would be highly probable; therefore, we apply the benefit of the doubt to award proactively. We also have some related to cumulative joint trauma tools.

We are definitely moving in that direction. We have quite a few of those EEGs and we'll continue to build more.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

There are a lot of different injuries. I learned from one veteran who had a helicopter accident and got treatment for his back. He did not realize that the back is split into four different areas, and if you only apply for one area, you do not get support for the others.

Is there not a way to make this more accessible to veterans who would not know that they have to make sure that they and their doctors have to apply for the entire back?

[Steven Harris]

There are a couple of things. One is that we use the diagnosis that doctors give us. A veteran will have a diagnosis from a doctor as to the extent of their injuries. If they've put in applications, we'll look at what we can do to respond to the injuries or illness that they may have suffered on that front.

It goes back to what the deputy spoke about in the first hour about a modernization of a table of disabilities. We use an extensive document of a table of disabilities that touches on all various aspects of the human body. It is a very intricate and complex piece that we need to simplify to make it easier for veterans and for doctors.

[Cathay Wagantall, Conservative, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

That would be awesome. Thank you so much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Thank you.

The last intervention is going to come from Mr. Darrell Samson for five minutes.

Please go ahead.

Mr. Samson, please open your mike.