Veterans Affairs Committee on Feb. 12th, 2024

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Comparing the situation from six years ago to that of today, what changes and improvements have you made?

[Steven Harris]

The Department of Veterans Affairs now works more closely with veterans and does preventive work with them, which helps to facilitate initial actions and to ensure the programs are implemented.

We want to make sure that people don't tell us six years later that they didn't have a good experience. We want them to contact us immediately during their transition to civilian life. Having said that, I acknowledge that there will always be a large number of people who will come back to see us after their transition. However, I want to be sure that most of the problems are solved during the transition.

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Harris.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Thank you, Mr. Harris and Mr. Desilets.

To conclude, I invite Ms. McPherson to go ahead for two and half minutes, please.

[Heather McPherson, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Thank you very much.

Having listened to the testimony today, it sounds to me like there are these programs and a wide range of different resources that are in place. I think we've tried to tease out how effective those programs are. There's the communication piece to make sure that veterans know that these programs are there, but what seems to me to be the cog for all of this is how many transition advisers we have and how well they are staffed across the country.

I'd like some more information about how many transition officers there are. What is that ratio? How many are there per veteran? Does that change whether it's in an urban or a rural setting? How is that managed? From my perspective, it does seem like the best-laid plans. You can have the very best programs in the world, but if there's no way to implement those programs, they don't work and they don't help our veterans.

Perhaps I could start with you, Commander.

[Cmdre Daniel Bouchard]

Yes, indeed.

To come back to your earlier question on communications about the research, ma'am, just very rapidly, we also have guides and electronic information through the digital transition centre, and that's how we provide a lot of our information.

With respect to the actual number of transition advisers, it really depends on the region. I was just in Bagotville, where they have a limited number of transitions. Therefore, there are fewer advisers in that region as opposed to here in Ottawa, for example, where the majority of our memberships will be older and there will be a larger number of people in transition—

[Heather McPherson, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

I'm sorry to interrupt you, Commander, but in general, across the entire program, what is the ratio?

[Cmdre Daniel Bouchard]

I have to get back to you on the actual specifics for that number.

[Heather McPherson, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

It would be great if you could let our analysts know that.

I'm sorry—and I interrupted you—but it's just in terms of making sure that there are adequate transition advisers. We know that there were deep cuts to Veterans Affairs under the previous administration and that it has not been built up under this administration to the way that it needs to be.

How do you feel that you are doing in terms of having the adequate ratio in place?

[Cmdre Daniel Bouchard]

We've been working very hard to establish the process and to have the transition centres fully operating, and then we'll be taking approximately a year to evaluate how those services are offered. We started to do some small changes internally, but at this time the needs of our members are met by the current staffing, with the plan that was in place.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Thank you very much.

This brings the first part of our meeting to an end. Before we move on to the second part, on the motion by Mr. Richards, I would like to welcome our guests.

Colleagues, we thank for being with us, from the Department of National Defence, Mr. Daniel Bouchard, commander of the Canadian Armed Forces transition group; and from the Department of Veterans Affairs, Steven Harris, assistant deputy minister, service delivery branch; Ms. Jane Hicks, acting director general, service delivery and program management; and Mr. Mark Roy, area director, central Ontario.

We'll now take a short break.

We will now suspend.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

We will resume.

In this second part, we will resume debate on the motion by Blake Richards. At the last meeting, an amendment was moved by MP Shaun Casey, to whom I yield the floor.

Please, go ahead.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

As you indicated, I think where we left off.... I'll leave it to you and the clerk as to whether we require a motion to resume debate. That's probably what would be in order, although I'm not sure that's what happened at the last meeting.

[An hon. member]

It was suspended.

[Sean Casey, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

No, I think it was adjourned because everyone had to leave at 6:30.

I guess the first thing I would say is that, in order for this to be properly in front of us, there's probably a requirement to have a motion to resume debate. Nonetheless, you called on me to speak to the amendment that I introduced once we started talking about the motion at our last meeting.

The amendment I introduced was actually to add another category of documents.

It's ironic that over the weekend there was a news story on this very topic, which was the lack of unanimity and dissent within the jury that made the decision and how very pleased one of the jury members was to hear that the government had reversed the decision made by the jury. Clearly, there will be documents around this. They've already been publicly reported as a result of being obtained by the media under an access to information request. If we're going on this fishing expedition for documents, this is a pond in which some fish will be found.

Again, I'm not sure the motion is properly before us, but you asked me to speak to this, so here we are.

The amendment I propose is that the motion be amended by adding, after paragraph b)(vii), the following: “And that Veterans Affairs Canada produce any correspondence received from members of the jury responsible for evaluating the finalist designs for the National Monument to Canada's Mission in Afghanistan since June of 2023.”

The rationale for it is as I set forward. I leave it to you to deal with whether the motion is properly before us. If and when it is, that's an amendment I would like to propose.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Thank you, Mr. Casey.

I would like to welcome Mr. Paul-Hus, who is joining us.

Mr. Desilets, you would like to take the floor to speak to this amendment.

[Luc Desilets, Bloc, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

Mr. Casey, we've heard your remarks in recent days, but there are also some documents circulating—

[Bryan May, Liberal, Cambridge, ON]

I have point of order.

There was a speaking list already established when this was adjourned.

I think Mr. Casey's question about whether we're in an appropriate situation right now without moving this motion needs to be answered, first of all.

Second of all, has the speaking list disappeared? It sounds like we're starting a new speaking list.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

Exactly, Mr. May. There was a speaking list, but it was on the motion.

At the last meeting, Mr. Casey had the floor, so he introduced that amendment, and we put it on the notice.

[Bryan May, Liberal, Cambridge, ON]

Did we get through the entire speaking list for Mr. Casey's amendment?

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

No, there was none.

[Bryan May, Liberal, Cambridge, ON]

I understand we're debating the amendment, but we had started that and there was a speaking list.

We adjourned and I'm simply asking if the speaking list gets wiped out.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

It was on the motion itself. Now we have an amendment—

[Bryan May, Liberal, Cambridge, ON]

We had nobody on the speaking list for his amendment.

[The Chair, Liberal, Emmanuel Dubourg]

No.