Veterans Affairs Committee on June 8th, 2026

[Steve Burton]

Again, when we're dealing with transparency, I do believe that's a part of it, because it's about communication. From the get-go, when I first meet a veteran, it is about outlining all of these things and even explaining some of the delays they might experience. Again, it's from a trauma-informed perspective, based what they've gone through, and there will be reactions to how the program is received or to delays and how those affect them. Once again, it's about education, combined with communication and transparency. I definitely believe that is the biggest piece to all of this.

I don't like the word “stories”, but when you hear the recounting by veterans of their experiences, again, there's almost a human interaction going on, and it's not the veterans'. It's based upon the human interactions where, again, the education about the program and the knowledge or experiences of the veteran are missed.

[Marie-Hélène Gaudreau, Bloc, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

Mr. Burton, it is only right for veterans to receive a service that reflects who they are. I think you're someone who can demonstrate that clinical expertise is key to getting the information out and explaining the process.

Our veterans seem to have dealt with people who had general training and lacked the necessary empathy to support them.

You seem to have a connection with veterans, but other specialists have said that it doesn't work.

Is clinical expertise essential?

[Steve Burton]

Yes. I would be putting myself out of a job if I said that clinical experience was not necessary. It is, and you're exactly right. If I could ensure that every clinician spent time in the CAF, in policing or in some type of first responder work, we would have no issues whatsoever. It is a perspective that does come into play.

As for the clinicians I work with, we work together very well. The knowledge of what I used to do and who I am helps in guiding their practice and their response to veterans too.

I would have to say, definitely, yes—back to your question—clinical experience is necessary.

[Marie-Hélène Gaudreau, Bloc, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

I really want us to get an idea of what people are going through right now.

Since the beginning of the study, we've heard disturbing testimony from health care professionals. In another study, a number of veterans made the same observation. They feel that the system is too rigid and that the bureaucracy is removed from their basic needs when they return to civilian life.

The study leaves me worried, but also troubled. These may be isolated cases, but, in my opinion, this is a responsibility that Veterans Affairs Canada must honour.

I only have a few seconds left, but I really want to assure veterans that we will keep going.

Mr. Brown, I will personally commit to pushing as long as it takes with Veterans Affairs Canada to make sure that you can deliver the services that veterans need and that you don't get turned down.

As for the denials of treatment, difficulty and lack of proximity, I really hope that what we understand people are experiencing right now ends, especially when it comes to defence deployment.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

Thank you, Ms. Gaudreau.

That concludes our first round of questions.

I will now give the floor to Mr. Viersen for five minutes.

[Arnold Viersen, Conservative, Peace River—Westlock, AB]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you to our witnesses for being here today.

Mr. Brown, I would like to start with you. This fall, the government has an option to renew the PCVRS contract. Would you recommend that the government renew that contract?

[Richard Brown]

Thank you, Mr. Viersen.

I would recommend that the government not renew the contract with Mr. Galen Weston, because, after all, I used to work for a Loblaws store when I released from the military, and I lost my job because of my injuries.

I was still under the three-month probation—in Ontario, that's what it is—so they can let you go anytime. I was having panic attacks. I was having flip-outs and stuff like that. I couldn't come to work, and they just said, “See you later.” Ultimately, I'm still waiting to see when Mr. Weston will be sitting in the House of Commons. It shouldn't be a dictatorship. It does need to be studied properly.

When I went through VRS, it was with the March of Dimes in Ontario. It was the same crap then as it is now.

It's all on what the government wants. They want timelines, because the bureaucrats want it, or their buddies all want it. It shouldn't be based on that. It should be based on the veteran. That's the exact reason I did that second assessment with Dr. Rajska, and because she takes the time to listen and to do a proper report.

I'm not saying that Dr. Richardson is a bad guy. Dr. Richardson was great at the OSI and getting that going in Montreal. Once again, he's under the pressure of the government.

In Ontario, veterans fall under two systems. We fall under the feds, and we also fall under provincial health care. In Ontario—I know it's bad all across, but specifically in southern Ontario—you can't get help. With Medavie Blue Cross, they tell me, “Oh yeah, you can go get this person.” I call them, and they say, “We haven't worked with Medavie in six years.”

There's another problem that we have. Medavie needs to be held accountable—the transparency—because if you go on their website under licensed providers, half of those people.... There was one on there, Terry Semple, who was one of my psychologists. He hasn't practised medicine in almost five years, yet he's still listed on there as a provider. Try to figure that one out.

I hope that it won't just be Mr. Carney saying, “Hey, you know what, Mr. Weston? We're giving you the contract.” It needs to be discussed further.

[Arnold Viersen, Conservative, Peace River—Westlock, AB]

Is it clear to you, at all, why the government signed a contract with PCVRS? What specific problem were they trying to solve?

[Richard Brown]

I'm not too aware of that, because, as I said, I'm just getting back into trying to get some help with my mental health and physical limitations.

I'm told that I can use only the one therapist, who is very pushy and has their own agenda. It's that level of care. In the new veterans charter, passed in 2006, the veteran is supposed to be able to call the shots, not everybody else, because we all have different tendencies. Every veteran is different. There is no status quo when it comes to mental health or physical injuries. It needs to be looked at across a broader spectrum.

[Arnold Viersen, Conservative, Peace River—Westlock, AB]

In your opening comments, you mentioned that you had to hire a lawyer to get your benefits. Could you talk a bit about that? Was there legal aid involved or anything like that, or did you pay for it out of your pocket?

[Richard Brown]

No, I didn't pay for that. I've gone through the bureau of pensions advocates not once but twice. Both were for mental health. I was lucky both times. I had the same attorney at the bureau of pensions advocates. I hope she's not going to lose her contract, because she took cases only if she could win. She had a 94% success rate.

When she looked at my case, she said, “I'm not even going to send this back to the department, because I know it's going to be revoked. We're going right to VRAB.” It took 18 months to get a hearing that lasted five minutes. They asked me two questions. I was in and out. He said, “Your attorney gave a good report. It's looking very favourable.” That was in August 2022. I didn't hear back about the decision until Valentine's Day 2023.

[Arnold Viersen, Conservative, Peace River—Westlock, AB]

I don't know if you're aware, but the government is cutting the bureau of pensions advocates funding. It's good to hear that you've used them. That's a case in point for not cutting their funding.

I want to thank you for your service, sir.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

Thank you very much, Mr. Viersen.

Now we will have Mr. Fanjoy for five minutes.

[Bruce Fanjoy, Liberal, Carleton, ON]

Thank you, witnesses.

Dr. Burton, I'd like to delve into Lifemark and its relationship with clinicians.

You mentioned that clinicians are a critical part of Lifemark. Are you an employee of Lifemark, or a contractor? Do you work outside Lifemark as well?

[Steve Burton]

Yes, I am an employee.

I was doing correctional work with inmates at Stony Mountain near Winnipeg. That was, again, another huge trauma point.

In the work I do, I have the opportunity to work privately as well—outside work time, so to speak.

[Bruce Fanjoy, Liberal, Carleton, ON]

Thank you.

Given that you can work privately as well as with Lifemark, I'd be interested in your perspective on what value Lifemark is bringing to this program.

[Steve Burton]

Again, experiences vary, obviously.

Lifemark has a large number of clinics across Canada that can service a number of veterans out there. As far as scale goes, Lifemark is one of the largest. It can accommodate the majority of veterans. There are veterans who prefer to live rurally or outside populated areas. We do our best, but there is travel for them, obviously, if they want to do in-person or physio-related work. It combines everything in one place. I think that's the biggest plus when we're talking about a clinic like Lifemark.

If you're experiencing anxiety about being in public places, you really have to just tolerate it for one visit. You could see your physiotherapist, occupational therapist or massage therapist and me, potentially, at the same time. I always liken it to.... I do the mental sort of massaging, with the physical massaging coming afterwards. That is the benefit of the Lifemark model.

My own experience in the clinic I work at has been one in which the interdisciplinary team works very well and closely together. I communicate with the physiotherapist—not outside confidentiality, of course—regarding what behavioural barriers or physical obstacles the patient is experiencing now. This could relate to something like, “Okay, they're experiencing a lot more stress and anxiety now, because they're feeling less worthwhile,” or, “Their self-esteem is lower because they can't mow the lawn.” These things keep coming up. Sharing that information and seeing how the person is doing are another benefit of the model.

[Bruce Fanjoy, Liberal, Carleton, ON]

Health care professionals are used to working together, even when they function privately. It's your testimony that they're better able to deliver those benefits for veterans under the Lifemark corporate umbrella.

[Steve Burton]

Again, with the general statement, it is applicable when, for example, a physiotherapist will follow a veteran down to see me with hot packs and things for their physical pain while I'm addressing and working with them. It's literally just down the hall. We have that proximity, but we also have the relationship that makes things easier.

[Bruce Fanjoy, Liberal, Carleton, ON]

A number of veterans live in rural communities. That's where their families and support networks are. It's not always the case that this is where there's ready access to health care professionals. How does Lifemark bridge that gap so that veterans can access services they need when they live in rural communities?

[Steve Burton]

Most of the time they can access providers in the community. That comes back to not restricting their ability to access those people. In addition, there are technological abilities, like virtual therapy, etc., so that we can communicate online like this. We do our best to accommodate, for sure.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marie-France Lalonde]

Thank you very much.

Ms. Gaudreau, you have the floor for two and a half minutes.

[Marie-Hélène Gaudreau, Bloc, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

Thank you.

Doing the best we can is what our veterans deserve.

Seriously, I'm really embarrassed. It's like telling people to enlist, but then figure out how to live in a rural community while having to drive two hours with back pain. As we know, there are rural areas in Canada, not just in Quebec.

I can give you a list of names. They all call me at my office. To me, that's unacceptable.

Let's say that we consider this and conduct an independent study to see what worked and what isn't working. Let's face reality and not just say that we are good despite everything.

Mr. Brown, while reform is needed, if there were one thing to do, one major thing that could change the game, what would it be?

[Richard Brown]

There are actually two that I believe could happen. Veterans Affairs, VRS and all of them need to start listening to veterans. Hire veterans to be case managers. They have the experience. Veterans help veterans. It's proven with the social media sites, with everybody online. It's crazy.

On top of that, I live 25 minutes from Niagara air force base in Niagara Falls, New York. That's how close I am to Buffalo. I talk to American veterans all the time through Facebook, social media or whatever. Their system is messed up like ours is, but it's getting better. The wait times are getting better. Case managers in the States can approve stuff.

In Canada, we have to put it through the rigmarole, and everything goes and sits on somebody's desk in Charlottetown, because that's where the Veterans Affairs head office apparently is.

That's how things can be fixed—hire veterans to work as case managers, and if they speak out, don't punish them.

[Marie-Hélène Gaudreau, Bloc, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

It's duplication.

I just want to thank all the witnesses for coming. I'm genuinely distressed. You are very brave to come here and testify.

I'm thinking of everyone who came here, those listening to us and our veterans. We will not give up. That's why we're here.