Mr. Speaker, I have two points in response. First, I agree with my friend from Elk Island that government is much too pervasive. It is and I agree completely. The second point which I piggyback on the first one is that too often in the House we fall into the trap we are in again today. He felt obliged to rise and say "the member has said nothing; he talked ad nauseam" and so on. With respect, I said several things I think the member on reflection would agree are substantive.
I talked about the basic premise for UI and the basic premise for OAS. He may not agree with these premises, but he cannot say they are all verbiage. They are statements. Whether he agrees with them or not is another issue. He falls into the trap, and I did to a degree in response, of always being obliged to knock what the other guy said.
I tried to give as considerate a statement as I could during my 20 minutes in which I said where I am coming from on the issue of social reform. I measured beforehand its success or failure in terms of to what degree the government listens and how much the government canvasses opinion.
What I have said in short, and probably could have said more briefly, is that the jury is out on this one. I am not up here saying this is the best thing since sliced bread because I cannot see it yet. I do not know what it is. We should not fall into the trap of just knocking the other guy because he sits on the other side of the House. I happen to agree with the member for Elk Island that the government is too pervasive. One of the goals of the reform package ought to be to get government out of some people's hair.