Mr. Speaker, we are talking about details in the way that this is set up versus process. That is what I am trying to draw to the attention of members opposite. I do not particularly like the way this is drawn up. I made that very clear. I have obviously riled some people on the other side of the House.
I disagree with the way it is. I have constituents who are very upset about it. Nonetheless, when we look at a process that is flawed and only becomes more seriously flawed when we all get into it, that is what I am expressing concern about. I think that is probably what we have heard more and more.
Let me address a couple of other issues before I close. Does this further divide rural and urban Canada? I spent my first 25 years living in Vancouver which is about to lose a riding, as I understand from the other side. I grew up practically in downtown Vancouver. I know what it is like to be a city person. I know the concerns of urban Canada.
I live in northeastern rural Alberta by choice. Many people are born in areas and there they are, citizens of that area just because. I chose to leave Vancouver and teach school in northeastern Alberta and so I am a rural Albertan by choice.
To me that says a lot. I realize both sides of the coin. I know what it is like to live in the city and to be able to go to the symphony which is about six or eight minutes from home. I also know what it is like to watch the Edmonton Oilers play hockey or watch the Edmonton Eskimos play football when it is a three hour, one way drive for me. I know what it is like to be a rural Canadian.
I would like to invite the commissioners who sit as the Alberta commissioners, two from Calgary, one from Edmonton, to come and spend a week with me in Beaver River, in my four by four. They would understand what rural Canada is all about. They would understand what it is like to travel 28,000 square kilometres regularly from end to end of our constituency. In terms of square kilometres mine is far smaller than many others. If we look at the map, if we look at the riding which is north of mine, Peace River, Athabasca, those take up physically literally half of Alberta's square kilometres.
Beaver River is small in comparison to that but I would love the commissioners to come with me in my four by four. I appreciate my friend from Broadview-Greenwood. We have known each other well over the years. I always remember his saying he could ride around Broadview-Greenwood on his
bicycle in about an hour and a half. I have given him a standing invitation to come on out to the "Beav" and we would see how far he would get on his bicycle-not very.
I looked up the mileage of the three vehicles that I have gone through since my election in March 1989. There is my basic four by four that I spend most of my time in the riding with. I have also put lots of miles on my truck and camper, a small car and another truck when I have needed to.
On my four by four that I do most of my business travelling with I have put 324,000 kilometres. I am no mathematician but I divided that out. It is basically 8,000 kilometres across Canada. That is 40.5 trips from sea to sea across and around Beaver River. That is an incredible number of miles.
Rural Canada is an exciting place to live but let me tell members that in terms of hours and time and driving and getting around, driving two hours or three hours one way to a one and a half hour meeting and then turning around driving three hours home again is an incredible amount of time chewed up. However, it is peaceful time.
Telephone time, if I need that, is marvellous. Why would we take that away from people? What is wrong with urban Canada's getting to know its country cousins better? Why could we not redraw these boundaries by taking a corner of the population out of a city and moving it into the rural areas? Why do we need to be so firm and obsessed with city boundaries all the time?
Why not take a corner out of some of the population of four or five thousand people in Edmonton and tell them they have something in common with these people? The guidelines that the commissioners were given say that boundary readjustment must take into account human interests and geographic characteristics.
Every one of those people who lives in Edmonton, Toronto or whatever is eating the bread that was grown for them on these farms. They do have something in common with urban and rural Canada. Why do we not celebrate that instead of always moving it off against each other? There are such divisions between the country and the city. We need to celebrate what we share in common rather than saying that person is from the country, that one is from the city and we have nothing more to gain from each other, we have precious little in common.
That is wrong. That is incorrect. We need to look at these things and say that there are problems in the way this commission has gone about doing it. However, that is not the end of the world. One does not make a matter worse by having the government and the Official Opposition jump up and say that we should shelve it, that we should try to come up with something better.
I would be in favour of that if I had a list of possibilities of what might be better. I really would. Let us make sure that we have some options on the table rather than saying that we will put a committee together. I get nervous when I see things like that and when I hear things like that.
As rural Canada and rural MPs are called upon to represent larger and larger areas, we need to be very careful that we do not get into the situation in which MPs feel absolutely worthless because they simply cannot cover the physical distance.
I think of my friend to the north of me from Athabasca, an incredibly large area. There is my friend from the western Arctic and my friend from Churchill. How do they get around? Why would we in Beaver River say that we are totally happy with being able to say take the north end of the riding and move it up to Athabasca, it can use a few thousand square kilometres extra, what the world? When one has 200,000 what is another 10,000 or 15,000?
Those are people who live there. Those are real people who live in Lac-la-Biche and they want to see their MP. They want to talk to their MP and know what their MP looks like and thinks. What about the people who live in St. Paul and Bonnyville and Cold Lake? They are going to become part of the Vegreville-St. Paul riding then, no problem. We will just throw a few thousand square kilometres on to that riding.
There have been rapports built up with members of Parliament. I suspect that is why there is nervousness built up on the government benches to a great extent. They have built up rapports with their constituents, absolutely. I have built up a rapport with mine. I have a fine group of people I represent and I am proud to say that I am the representative of Beaver River.
What about the people in bedroom communities of Edmonton, Namao, Gibbons, Bon Accord, Redwater? Those people are going to become part of Elk Island. Sorry, folks, we will just add a few thousand square kilometres on to Elk Island. My friend from Elk Island will represent any number of other towns. As I have heard so often today, the split or the general movement or flow of those people probably would not be to that area but to the west of them, over to St. Albert.
This is flawed. I have serious problems with it but the reason we are so concerned about this, let me reiterate very firmly, is that the process for this is dreadfully flawed. The process in my neighbour's province of Saskatchewan is the same thing.
Under this particular format it may lose a seat. We look at constitutional limitations on it. That is one thing. Do we toss it aside and say we are going to try and come up with something better? I hardly think so.
What about my neighbours in my home province of British Columbia where the population is growing at an incredibly rapid rate? They have some serious considerations about the flaws in this as well, where things were drawn up, where there are so many people.
Look at discrepancies in constituency numbers. These people need a chance to be able to say they will go to those hearings and we as Canadians or as members of Parliament will go to those public hearings because that is the system, that is the way it was set up and that is exactly what we need to do, not sit here in Parliament and cook up some deal in which we will shelve the thing for 24 months.
In closing, I hope that the Canadian public has learned something here today in terms of process about this whole review. Let us make sure that Parliament does not have its fingerprints all over this process. Let us open it up. Let us consult the people first and then make decisions.
A motion to adjourn the House under Standing Order 38 deemed to have been moved.