Debates of March 17th, 1995

The Late Jill Brown

[Marlene Catterall, Liberal, Ottawa West, ON]

Mr. Speaker, today our community mourns the death of a courageous woman.

Jill Brown was honoured in this city as a businesswoman, a fundraiser and contributor to numerous charities, as a city councillor, and as a wife and mother.

Yesterday Jill Brown ended her life as she lived it: spirited, defiant, taking charge, refusing to let the leukaemia that had devastated her for over a year decide the time of her death.

I shared with Jill the privilege of representing the people of Britannia ward on city council. She came to know, love and respect them. They in turn loved and respected her.

I convey to her family, her husband Brian, her children, Shannon, Michael and Chris, our condolences.

Private Utilities Income Tax Transfer

[Dave Chatters, Reform, Athabasca, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Natural Resources was quoted as saying that Ottawa may not be able to tax crown owned utilities, but she would like to hear ideas on how to put them on level ground with investor owned electricity and natural gas utilities.

I know for a fact that a coalition of privately owned utility companies from across Canada sent this minister a copy of their document entitled: "Equitable Tax Treatment for Utilities in Canada". It represents a fair alternative that would increase the utility costs by less than 1 per cent for all Canadians instead of a 7.5 per cent increase for Albertans and Nova Scotians as proposed in the budget.

If the minister really is serious about fairness she would seriously consider their ideas before she cuts the private utilities income tax transfer. She would also advise the Minister of Finance to commit to doing this when he meets with Calgary's mayor today.

Canadian Federation Of Students

[Mauril Bélanger, Liberal, Ottawa—Vanier, ON]

Mr. Speaker, as the member for Ottawa-Vanier I have the honour of representing the University of Ottawa in this House. The students' federation of the university is about to hold a referendum on whether or not the students wish their campus to maintain its membership in the Canadian Federation of Students.

In its eagerness to have the university remain a member, the CFS may have given the students less than completely accurate information to encourage them to vote yes in the referendum. The federation has claimed that it, the CFS, has forced the Liberal government to stop the social security review.

The students of the University of Ottawa and students across the country should know that the social security review is moving forward. That means the government is still committed to finding better ways of working, learning and providing security for those in need of it.

Mochovce Nuclear Power Plant

[Nelson Riis, NDP, Kamloops, BC]

Mr. Speaker, the European Bank of Reconstruction and Development is about to make a crucial decision about the financing of the Mochovce nuclear power plant in Slovakia.

Expert sources indicate this nuclear reactor is neither environmentally nor economically viable. Along with its technical flaws and overall concern for safety, the energy output of this nuclear reactor is not necessary to either the current or future needs of the people of Slovakia.

The European parliament, many countries, and all major environmental groups in Europe, the United States and Canada are calling for a delay or cancellation of this nuclear project. Furthermore, more than half the Slovakian population oppose the construction of nuclear power plants.

For Canada to vote in favour of this project would not only waste Canadian tax dollars in a very dangerous energy megaproject but would also subject the people of Slovakia to a huge debt load.

I urge the Government of Canada to vote against this proposal and not waste Canadian tax dollars.

Agriculture

[Leon Benoit, Reform, Vegreville, AB]

Mr. Speaker, yesterday in the House I asked for clarification from the agriculture minister on exactly who the Crow payment is intended to benefit: landowners or actual farmers. I did not receive an answer to this very basic question. This is extremely frustrating since western Canadian farmers have a number of other questions they would like this government to answer as well.

For example, is the purpose of the $1.6 billion payout to compensate for losses in land value, or is it meant to be a transition fund for farmers who have lost the Crow benefit but are still shipping grain? What accommodations have been made within the phase out plan for renters and lessors? How will the money be paid to farmers? When can farmers expect to receive the money? Specifically, what measures will be taken to allow the system to become more efficient and to give farmers more flexibility in marketing?

The government must not keep western Canadian farmers in the dark on these issues any longer. Farmers must be able to plan with certainty and recoup some of the losses which will result from these cuts.

Fisheries

[Roger Simmons, Liberal, Burin—St. George's, NL]

Mr. Speaker, the turbot is a miserable looking little fish. Who in his or her right mind would have ever thought it could have rallied an entire nation and why? Because the latest pillaging of fish stocks by Spanish trawlers has become the straw that has broken the camel's back.

Enough is enough, say Canadians. Canadians right across this country now realize that Newfoundland and Atlantic fishermen and plant workers are the unwitting victims here, not the lazy hangashores they have been portrayed as over the years.

The government of this country has finally done what any government worth its salt should have done years ago when I first raised the matter seven years ago in this House. For that, I thank the Prime Minister for keeping his election promise on this issue. I congratulate my friend and colleague, the Minister of Fisheries and Oceans, for his handling of the issue.

Peacekeepers

[John Richardson, Liberal, Perth—Wellington—Waterloo, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I rise today to pay tribute to Canada's peacekeepers.

Since 1956 Canada has taken part in almost every United Nations peacekeeping operation. With good reason Canadians are proud of our participation in these forces. Since 1947 more than 90,000 Canadians have participated in peacekeeping missions.

As I speak more than 3,000 Canadians are currently deployed somewhere in the world as part of peacekeeping operations. These proud soldiers made up of part time reservists and full time regulars have given Canada a proud name in this sphere.

In the former Yugoslavia alone more than 2,000 Canadians are working in the most strenuous situations and are performing admirably under the strain.

Over the period of three years approximately 300 of the soldiers serving have been reservists. It is Canada's reserves that are demonstrating the ultimate commitment in the battles of patriotism and duty.

I salute the Canadians currently in peacekeeping operations. Canada's great traditions of patience, forbearance and commitment are safe in their hands.

Canadian Advisory Council On The Status Of Women

[Michel Gauthier, Bloc, Roberval, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is directed to the government. I do not know to whom it is directed, but someone will surely rise to give an answer.

Yesterday, the Deputy Prime Minister said that to avoid patronage and prevent order in council appointments of friends of the government, the government decided to abolish the Canadian Advisory Council on the Status of Women. That is what she said, although it is rather surprising.

Considering the important role played by the Advisory Council on the Status of Women, would the Deputy Prime Minister or another member of the government not agree that it was not absolutely unnecessary to abolish the council in order to avoid partisan order in council appointments and that the government should simply have opted for another appointment process that would guarantee the arm's length position of the members?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons and Solicitor General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, as part of our effort to have a government that is efficient and effective and very conscious of expense, the government has decided to merge these various programs under the very capable leadership of the Secretary of State for the Status of Women. I think this will turn out to be a very effective use of the necessary resources.

The hon. member is always talking about the need to avoid overlapping and duplication. I am surprised he is not praising this initiative because it is exactly along the lines he is calling for, the avoiding of overlapping and duplication.

[Michel Gauthier, Bloc, Roberval, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I am sure you understand why I will have to repeat my question. As for eliminating duplication, there are whole federal departments we could get rid of, not an advisory council that serves the status of women, but whole departments that duplicate the work done by provincial departments. We have a few suggestions for the government if it needs some help in this area.

Are we to infer from what the Deputy Prime Minister said that the committee appointed by the government to review the CRTC's decision on direct tv broadcasting, consisting of Gordon Ritchie, Roger Tassé and Robert Rabinovitch, is a committee appointed by order in council, thus involving friends of the government who are responsible for reaching a decision where several billion dollars are at stake, a decision that concerns all Canadians?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons and Solicitor General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member wants to be logical, but where is the logic in his questions when he complains about our merging women's programs and at the same time criticizes duplication and overlap?

Once again, if the hon. member wants to be logical, I would ask him to support our decision, so that women receive the kind of support they need.

[Michel Gauthier, Bloc, Roberval, QC]

Mr. Speaker, let us get this straight. We referred to a statement by the Deputy Prime Minister in which she said that the Advisory Council on the Status of Women was abolished because it was a hotbed of patronage, because these were order in council appointments, and that the best way to avoid that was to abolish the council. That is what we are talking about.

That being said, since, as the Deputy Prime Minister admitted, order in council appointments are partisan appointments and cabinet still insists on appointing the government's ethics counsellor, would the government not agree that it should change its approach, act on the opposition's request and have the

ethics counsellor appointed by the House of Commons instead of by order in council?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons and Solicitor General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member has been opposition House leader for some time now. He should know that is not a supplementary question.

Canadian Broadcasting Corporation

[Roger Pomerleau, Bloc, Anjou—Rivière-Des-Prairies, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Finance. Again yesterday, the Minister of Canadian Heritage stated the following: "Radio-Canada, my source, confirmed that no cuts were announced. I assume this means no staff cuts or layoffs have been decided". However, all the papers announced yesterday that 750 positions would be abolished at Radio-Canada as the result of the cuts imposed by the government.

Can the Minister of Finance confirm that Radio-Canada will face cuts of $350 million over three years as Vice-President Michèle Fortin reaffirmed on Monday?

[Albina Guarnieri, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Minister of Canadian Heritage]

Mr. Speaker, we know that Radio-Canada's management will be well able to meet this challenge. No one here underestimates the challenges facing the CBC. In the end, Canadians will continue to enjoy the high quality broadcasting the CBC is famous for.

[Roger Pomerleau, Bloc, Anjou—Rivière-Des-Prairies, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask a supplementary question.

Would the Minister of Finance confirm that the government had told the CBC that the cuts for the three coming years would be $44 million, $96 million and $165 million, as Mr. Manera informed us when he resigned? The Minister of Canadian Heritage had refused to confirm those cuts.

[Albina Guarnieri, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Minister of Canadian Heritage]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member likes to speculate, and they do not make very good gamblers.

Currently it is up to the CBC to determine the best way to administer its limited resources within the financial realities that exist.

Canada Post

[Ken Epp, Reform, Elk Island, AB]

Mr. Speaker, we have trouble right here in Ottawa city; that starts with t and it rhymes with e and that spells ethics.

All this week the Reform Party has been asking the Prime Minister to direct the ethics counsellor to investigate the Canada Post building contract and the influence of Jose Perez and political officials in the tendering process. The Prime Minister has refused our request on the grounds that these events took place under a previous administration.

How would an investigation of the postal building contract differ from the investigation of the Pearson airport contract which also took place under a previous administration?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons and Solicitor General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister pointed out that the ethics counsellor had been appointed to review complaints about ministers and other order in council appointees and possibly to look into the matter of lobbyists. The matter raised by the hon. member is not something for which the position of ethics counsellor has been created.

I want to say to the hon. member that certainly, as the Prime Minister said, it was something that took place under a previous government. The Minister of Public Works who reports to Parliament for Canada Post is reviewing the situation. I am sure he will have more to say about it when he completes his review.

[Ken Epp, Reform, Elk Island, AB]

Mr. Speaker, irrespective of the minister's answer, a number of serious issues need to be addressed.

Developers need to be assured that Mr. Perez had no unfair advantage. Taxpayers need to be assured that their money is being spent correctly and wisely. Most of all, Canadians need to be assured that either the politicians and bureaucrats did nothing wrong, or if they did do something wrong that they will be exposed.

I have a supplementary question. Will the government's presumed commitment to restoring integrity in the political institutions allow the ethics commissioner to investigate these issues?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons and Solicitor General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, the estimates of Canada Post have been tabled before the House and referred to the appropriate parliamentary committee.

I suggest my hon. friend consider that the matter could well be raised when the Canada Post estimates are studied by the appropriate parliamentary committee. If my hon. friend is concerned about a stronger role for committees, he might examine this possibility.

[Ken Epp, Reform, Elk Island, AB]

Mr. Speaker, integrity is missing; the perception of it is missing. This is not the first time the Reform Party has asked for the ethics counsellor to investigate issues on behalf of Canadians. Every time we get the answer no. It seems the Prime Minister is only willing to unleash his ethics lap dog when it is suitable to the government.

If the government is unwilling to let the ethics counsellor investigate in matters of public contracts, why should Canadians have any trust at all in the ethics counsellor of the lobbyists act?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons and Solicitor General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, I think Canadians could ask why they should have any confidence in the kinds of questions asked by the Reform member when the facts are that the ethics counsellor has been appointed to look into matters involving ministers and order in council appointees, and when the Reform Party is not willing to follow up my suggestion that the matter could be explored when Canada Post estimates are being studied by the appropriate parliamentary committee.

Where is their commitment to an effective operation of the House of Commons and its committees?

Funding For Cdecs

[Réal Ménard, Bloc, Hochelaga—Maisonneuve, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Finance.

The Corporations de développement économique et communautaire de Montréal, or CDECs, are funded by Ottawa, Quebec and municipal governments. While the provincial and municipal governments have committed themselves to funding the corporations for the next three years, the Minister of Human Resources Development will only guarantee funding for six months. After this date, the department will no longer be responsible for funding CDECs.

My question is the following: Are we to understand that, after hitting the economy of Montreal so hard in the last budget, the federal government will also refuse to commit to funding these frontline economic development organizations for more than six months?

[Paul Martin, Liberal, Minister of Finance and Minister responsible for the Federal Office of Regional Development-Quebec]

Mr. Speaker, I believe that, judging from how much the federal government has contributed to various initiatives in Montreal, it is obvious that it plays a very, very important role and we intend to continue to do so.