Debates of May 2nd, 1995

Aboriginal Affairs

[Mike Scott, Reform, Skeena, BC]

Mr. Speaker, in the secret briefing document mentioned by the member for Calgary Southwest the minister states: "By responding to treaty issues the federal government will avoid being placed in a position of trying to explain why it is not keeping its red book promises."

Clearly the minister is cynically going through the motions. He is following an incoherent and unprincipled approach.

In light of the revelations in the secret briefing document, will the minister admit he does not actually have an effective and practical treaty policy?

[Ron Irwin, Liberal, Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development]

Mr. Speaker, let us talk about principle. The hon. member's riding is 30 per cent aboriginal. Within his riding I saw a certain generosity, which I do not find in the member, from the people of Terrace, Prince Rupert, Stewart, Smithers, Kitimat and Port Edward.

Out of curiosity last week I checked with the Vancouver office and did a comparison on Jim Fulton who represented the same area as the member. Jim Fulton sent 600 letters in four years regarding aboriginal people. This member has sent two letters in a year and a half-

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.

[Ron Irwin, Liberal, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

On principle from the hon. member I will not wait for his letter.

[Mike Scott, Reform, Skeena, BC]

Mr. Speaker, in the leaked briefing document the minister warns his cabinet colleagues that after 18 months of confusion: "The federal government cannot postpone the development of an effective and practical treaty policy".

Obviously the minister has no such policy. Will the the minister promise that if he ever does manage to develop a coherent policy he will share it with minor players like Parliament and the Canadian people?

[Ron Irwin, Liberal, Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development]

Mr. Speaker, I did not hear the question.

[The Speaker]

I invite, without preamble the putting of the question. The hon. member for Skeena.

[Mike Scott, Reform, Skeena, BC]

Mr. Speaker, will the minister promise that if he ever does manage to develop a coherent policy he will share it with minor players like Parliament and the Canadian people?

[Ron Irwin, Liberal, Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development]

Mr. Speaker, I disagree that Parliament and the Canadian people are in the same category as my hon.

friend suggests. I am quite happy to share the treaty process on inherent rights with Parliament as soon as it is available. I hope to have it available fairly quickly.

Bosnia

[Jean-Marc Jacob, Bloc, Charlesbourg, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Foreign Affairs.

Following a Croat offensive against the Serb enclave Krajina, Serb forces retaliated by taking 115 police officers and peacekeepers hostage. In addition, the UN's special envoy, Mr. Akashi, left Sarajevo yesterday without a signed agreement on extending the ceasefire in Bosnia.

Will the Minister of Foreign Affairs update us on the situation of the hostages and can he reassure us that everything has been done to protect Canadian peacekeepers stationed in Bosnia and Croatia?

[André Ouellet, Liberal, Minister of Foreign Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, the situation is certainly very serious and we hope that the representative of the United Nations, Mr. Akashi, will be successful in negotiating with the parties, on the one hand, the release of the hostages, and, on the other, a ceasefire which would bring lasting peace to this part of the world.

I can reassure the hon. member and the other members of this House that we are taking appropriate measures, in collaboration with the other countries which have contributed to this UN peacekeeping mission, to protect the soldiers participating in this mission as much as possible.

There are risks inherent in being a soldier, by the very nature of the work, but we are also aware that we cannot keep troops in a situation where the role they are intended to play as peacekeepers no longer has its place. That is why we are in the process of re-examining the whole issue in collaboration with the other governments concerned.

[Jean-Marc Jacob, Bloc, Charlesbourg, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the minister has said a great deal about negotiations. Can he confirm that the UN has made no progress during its negotiations with the Serbs on the reopening of the humanitarian airlift into Sarajevo, and will he admit that he fears that the end of the ceasefire marks the beginning of out-and-out war?

[André Ouellet, Liberal, Minister of Foreign Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, we regret that the parties did not accept to extend the ceasefire period. However, we hope that the fact that the ceasefire is over does not necessarily mean a new onslaught of hostilities. Efforts have been made to bring the parties to use restraint and to not resume hostilities, even though they have chosen not to renew the ceasefire.

We are perfectly aware that the situation could deteriorate. That is why we have placed our trust in the representative of the United Nations, whom we support in all of his efforts.

Aboriginal Affairs

[Jay Hill, Reform, Prince George—Peace River, BC]

Mr. Speaker, the government has recently appointed a chief federal negotiator to help interpret the recently recognized 1760 Murray treaty. This leaky brief, or should I say leaked brief, of the minister states: "Our participation could not be postponed for fear of being perceived as not wanting to discuss the treaty and allowing Quebec to take the lead in a tense political climate".

If the government is only participating because of the Quebec sovereignist agenda does the federal negotiator have a real mandate to interpret the treaties in contemporary terms as promised in the red book?

[Ron Irwin, Liberal, Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development]

Mr. Speaker, the Murray treaty was signed by General Murray. The Iroquois, who were allies of Quebec, found themselves on the wrong side of the battle line. It allowed them to get back into Quebec. However, it is vague.

[Randy White, Reform, Fraser Valley West, BC]

Very vague.

[Ron Irwin, Liberal, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

Why does the hon. member not check that? He has probably never heard of the Huron and probably does not even know where the Murray treaty launched them. I will give him this lesson.

Max Gros-Louis is the leader of the Hurons. Both the province of Quebec and Mr. Cliche through the premier and the government want to negotiate the Murray treaty, and we are. The negotiator is there. It is up and going. I am sure that when the results come out, long after the government has been defeated-pardon me, after the Reform Party has disappeared, Freudian slip-this will be very-

[Some hon. members]

Order.

[Ron Irwin, Liberal, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

Let me finish. This will be very important because it will give the leader of the-

[The Speaker]

The hon. member for Prince George-Peace River.

[Jay Hill, Reform, Prince George—Peace River, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I was chuckling because of the difficulty the minister has as he stumbles over the word plan. He has no plan.

Quoting once again from the leaked document: "The aim is to develop a strategy to address the red book commitment, manage expectations and develop federal views on the substance of a contemporary treaty process". The government does not intend to address treaty issues until this fall and until then, "there will be no authority to commit to substantive treaty processes".

How is it possible for the federal representative to negotiate in good faith with First Nations in Quebec when he has no authority?

[Ron Irwin, Liberal, Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development]

Mr. Speaker, I do have authority. My friend talks about a leaked document. Perhaps he should talk about a stolen document which would be more appropriate.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.

[The Speaker]

In the sense of the word and the way it was used I ask the hon. minister to please withdraw the word "stolen".

[Ron Irwin, Liberal, Sault Ste. Marie, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I will withdraw the word. I would not suggest the Reform Party would steal anything, let alone a good idea.

If the question is whether we have authority and are negotiating, the answer is yes. We are negotiating and my negotiator does have authority. We will be working in concert with the province of Quebec.