Madam Speaker, Bill C-85 has a double dipping feature. I might add that I introduced a private members' bill which calls for addressing the real double dipping issue. My bill on double dipping is not included in Bill C-85 but I propose it be considered. Members of Parliament who are elected and receive pensions or other income would have their MP salaries reduced dollar for dollar with respect to the pensions they are receiving.
I say this because a host of members of Parliament stand in this House from time to time and call for a reduction of this or a bidding down of that. They are receiving huge pensions, whether they are military pensions like the Reform Party members, or MLA pensions like the Reform Party members, or municipal pensions or provincial government pensions or pensions from companies or government agencies, boards and commissions.
Those members stand and say: "Let us cut this and cut that because we are already getting $61,000 a year or $41,000 in big pensions". Canadians have to be aware of that. I would like to see this bill adopted by this House. If you are receiving a $60,000 a year pension, then you can serve your country for a $60,000 pension plus $4,000 more to make up the difference between the member of Parliament salary and the money already being received from the public treasury.
However, I do not see the Reform members standing up and talking about this, or even the Liberal government members. However I would ask members to consider that.
With respect to the money purchase recommendation I have said the NDP government in Saskatchewan and New Democrats across this country have led pension reform. We have had a tradition of working toward a fair plan. To ensure fairness the Liberal government must appoint an independent commission to review this legislation to ensure it is fair for taxpayers and plan benefactors. As long as MPs are setting their own benefits, Canadian taxpayers will believe benefits are too generous.
I might add that Saskatchewan is a model yet again today. It has led Canada for 16 years in pension reform but today it introduced pension legislation yet one more time. It has announced a series of reforms to the MLA pensions which are deemed by the Canadian Taxpayers Federation and the National Citizens' Coalition already to be the fairest in the land.
I quote from an article by the Association of Saskatchewan Taxpayers:
The pension plan for Saskatchewan MLAs elected after 1979 is one of the fairest political pension plans in Canada. For every dollar these MLAs contribute to their pension fund, taxpayers match it by $1. MLAs can only draw benefits based on what their own fund earns.
This is called a defined contribution plan which is forced to pay for itself and therefore will not develop an unfunded liability. The only province with a more taxpayer friendly plan is Alberta which has no plan.
The article goes on:
The Canadian Taxpayers Federation has called on other provincial and federal politicians to adopt the 1979 Saskatchewan model of reform, with one exception which was noted in the May 1994 issue of The Taxpayer . The politicians of 1979 refused to lead by example and hoarded the rich old pension plan for themselves. This one catch in the scenario keeps growing uglier since we first took issue with it.
In response to the last part, the Saskatchewan government has rolled back the pre-1979 pension plan for members. It has capped the pension for current members who are contributing to a defined benefit plan at 70 per cent, based on four-year averages. This will expand restrictions as well in the new bill on double dipping to include members of the House of Commons, members of the Canadian Senate, judges of any court and any employment or service paid for by the Government of Canada or any other province or territory.
Saskatchewan has gone one step further in double dipping as well as the pension plan. It will eliminate the special pension allowance for the premier that was introduced in the 1960s by Liberal Premier Ross Thatcher.
I call on the Liberal government to refer the matter of the Prime Minister's bonus of $50,000 at age 65 to an independent commission. The Liberal government should take some leadership and eliminate the wealthy Prime Minister's special bonus, as Premier Roy Romanow has done in Saskatchewan with his pension and those of members who served in the legislature prior to 1979.
In summary, I appreciate the concern and the interest of Canadian taxpayers on this issue. Bill C-85 goes a long way in addressing the major concerns of Canadians. However, regardless of what we do, when MPs produce and pass legislation respecting their own salary and benefits, Canadians will always perceive it to be too generous.
I ask the government to consider this aspect and not to refer the bill to the procedures and House affairs committee, which is a nice good old club of MPs, but to refer the legislation to an independent commission and let it establish once and for all, apart from elected members, what our pay and benefits should be.