moved:
Motion No. 11
That Bill C-45, in Clause 43, be amended a ) by replacing lines 25 to 35, on page 25, with the following:
"(2) Subsection 130(4) of the Act is repealed"; and b ) by deleting lines 1 to 9, on page 26.
Motion No. 17
That Bill C-45, in Clause 51, be amended by replacing lines 40 to 44, on page 33, and lines 1 to 9, on page 34, with the following:
"139. Notwithstanding any provision in this or any other Act of Parliament, where an offender who is subject to a sentence that has not expired receives an additional sentence, the offender shall serve the total of the unexpired portion of the sentence the offender was serving at the time the offender received the additional sentence and then shall serve the full term of the additional sentence."
Madam Speaker, the majority of our amendments in this section will address violent offenders.
Once again we see in Bill C-45 that there has been an effort by the government to do something to address violent offenders, that those guilty of child abuse, child aggravated assault or child sexual assault should not be released. No one can disagree with that.
Once again here is an example of a government saying it will move in the direction Canadians want, but it does not go far enough.
Who is a child? If the child is 15 and is assaulted, does that count? Do they have to be under 14, according to the age of majority? What are the guidelines? Are we to say in the case of the Bernardo trial to the French and the Mahaffy families that their daughters were in their upper teens and therefore were not children, and that Mr. Bernardo could be released some time in the future? If that is what it is saying, it is totally wrong.
Aggravated assault on anyone, I do not care what their age, when violence is shown by these offenders in that fashion there is absolutely no reason in the world they should be released at any time until we are absolutely certain they will never do it again. If that means we have to wait until they are 90 years old, so be it.
What the Canadian people want more than anything else if they are to feel safe is to be assured by the government that dangerous violent offenders will not be on the streets because of the bleeding hearts of this country who say we cannot keep them behind bars forever.
Let us make a separation. A lot of people in penitentiaries are non-violent. Many of them should not even be in there. Let us start separating these two categories. Let us help those who genuinely made mistakes, who did no harm to individuals.
If they are non-violent let us treat them as such. Let us look at what we can do to rehabilitate them back into the community. Maybe we need to look at some alternative measures that would prevent them from going there in the first place and let communities deal with these problems, people who are closest to the scene.
When it comes to individuals who hunt down children or women or any kind of a victim with ball bats just to kill them, those are the kinds of people we do not need in this country, certainly not on our streets. If the best solution we have is to keep them behind bars, for heaven's sake let us do it.
I am not certain how accurate some reports are. Recently I read a report by Diane Francis who claimed she received her information from the solicitor general's office, that 78 individuals were released from penitentiaries and went on to murder. It did not say how many people they murdered but if 78 people committed murder, it was definitely no less than 78.
I remember a year or two ago when we first came to the House I asked the solicitor general about a list we had compiled. Our little research group had managed to find 46 individuals who had been released who were violent and killed again.
In one of those instances I remember a quote in the newspaper from the convict, and it was the first time I have been able to agree fully with a convict: "The only thing crazier than me is a system that would let me out to do what I did". Finally the whole truth is spoken. It is plum crazy.
Special interest groups are running around all over the country. They have the ear of the solicitor general and the ear of the justice department. They simply will not accept that locking them up and throwing away the key is the answer.
Probably 90 per cent of Canadians would agree with me when I say for some individuals that is the only answer. There is a better answer for some of these individuals. It is called capital punishment. It is my opinion that should apply to some individuals.
Clifford Olson may be eligible. He will be heard in 1995, I believe. Under section 745 of the Criminal Code he could be considered for release, although I am quite certain he will not be. I have a little more faith in our justice system than that, that they would not let him out. Nevertheless, he can apply, and will because he has been complaining and moaning and groaning over the last few years.
It saddens me that we even have to consider such a thing, that we have to go to the trouble of having a trial and the expense of paying individuals to sit and listen to the likes of these individuals.
He killed once, then he killed twice, then there were three, four, five, six. As far as we know, he killed about a dozen times. This individual killed once and got life and 25 years. He killed 11 or 12 more times for free; it did not cost him anything.
Then he goes to our justice department and makes a bargain. Give me $10,000 for every body I lead you to, put it in a trust fund, and I will start telling you what I did with these children I killed. And we fell into this bargain. We bargained with an individual like that.
I dare anyone in the House to go to any community or any town in the country and stand on a street corner and ask any Canadian what he thinks of our justice system that made a bargain with Clifford Olson to the point where he now has $100,000 in a trust account for his family because he told us where to find the bodies of the people he murdered. That is an example of what people do not want.
The message should be loud and clear to individuals of that type, these highly dangerous, violent offenders: You are not a welcome segment to our society; we do not want you; we do not need you. For heaven's sake, let us make our communities really safe. Make the streets safe for our children who are walking home from school.
Why should we have to worry about the mother who has to work at 11 o'clock in the evening in a convenience store and who was kidnapped and murdered? We have to consider whether it was a planned murder. Maybe it was just second degree or maybe even manslaughter. It was a violent act, which is not acceptable in this society. But the government will not show through its legislation that it is not acceptable. It makes it look acceptable.
The motion is going to try to send a message to all Canadians that we parliamentarians in the 35th Parliament are a little more serious than they have been in the past about doing something with those who commit a crime. We will continue our prevention programs and do as much as we can. We will continue to try to rehabilitate those who can be rehabilitated. We will do all the right things. But when push comes to shove and there are individuals such as Clifford Olson and Paul Bernardo, let us put an end to it. Never again should those kinds of things happen. Send the message and let us do it with these types of motions.