Mr. Speaker, this bill, which was introduced by my colleague from Hochelaga-Maisonneuve, attempts to deal with a very serious problem. I would like to say at the outset that we support what the member is doing and we support his bill.
As the member opposite has just said, there are some very serious issues at stake here. The member who introduced the bill has been very candid about the fact that there are some very serious competing interests which need to be weighed in taking the action he has proposed. He has not hidden the fact that this is not an action he undertakes lightly nor that Canadians should accept lightly. What he is arguing and the argument that I at least accept is that this is a serious enough situation so that serious measures are warranted and should be supported by our legislators.
Organized crime is a very serious problem in our country, a problem which unfortunately is growing. Many people do not have a very clear idea of just how large a problem it is.
I was speaking last weekend with a gentleman who works for the intelligence arm of a police service in our country. Some of the things he told me were shocking, disturbing and even frightening. I asked him why nobody knew what he had told me. I did not know. Why do Canadians not know? It is their country, it is their safety, it is their future at stake. Why do we not have a better idea of some of these difficulties? In his opinion, and it is only one man's opinion, he said there was a feeling that nobody knows what to do with the problem. Therefore it is better that we do not try to face it and make it explicit because then we would actually have to do something about it.
It is very important that members of Parliament not alarm the public unnecessarily. It is important that members of Parliament use discretion and deal with serious national concerns in a very moderate and balanced manner.
When the country has serious problems it is no longer acceptable to simply ignore them or hide them by sweeping them under the carpet. I applaud the member for Hochelaga-Maisonneuve who has recognized not just in his area but in other areas of the country that this is a crime, a serious situation which we have to squarely face. We need to put our heads together to come up with some
solutions and strategies to contain the problem and if possible to diminish it.
As the hon. member very sensibly and very appropriately points out, this may not be the best or the only solution to the problem, but at least it is a solution. Goodness knows the justice department and the justice minister have put forward nothing better to date.
I found it very disturbing that the government representative who just spoke, having no other solution and having put forward nothing at all to deal with this very serious problem, would refuse to even allow the bill to be examined by the justice committee of the House. The government is just killing it without any alternative and without facing up to a very serious problem. We have not properly examined and heard witnesses and had expert opinion on the proposals in this private member's bill to the extent we would like to.
The member was very sensible to put forward an opportunity for the House to examine his proposals. Out of that examination very likely would have come, as the member candidly admits, even better or stronger proposals and at least the issue would be on the table.
The Liberal government has swept the issue right back under the carpet, not wanting to even talk about what we might do to contain a very serious problem. I find that completely unacceptable as a member of this House who is charged with acting in the best interests of Canadians and with dealing with the country's major concerns.
The member is seeking in the bill to add a new charge to the Criminal Code making it an offence to live off the avails of criminal proceeds. This would particularly affect members of criminal organizations. There are a number of criminal organizations in Canada: biker gangs, the Mafia, the Russian Mafia, Asian gangs. Because of this country's weak and toothless administration of justice, unfortunately the evidence is that these organizations are not being contained. In fact, as the hon. member stated in his presentation, his concern and the concern of other people is that the impact of these organizations on our country is growing.
This bill would also affect individuals who associate with these criminal organizations and would make them guilty by association. That is the bone of contention in this legislation. As the House knows, our charter of rights and freedoms protects Canadians' right of association. That is a very important democratic right and one which should not be trifled with without very serious advantage to our society. It must clearly and unquestionably be in the public interest to do so.
One of the hon. member's colleagues introduced a bill last week that would change some of the procedures in our courts to protect witnesses in cases of sexual assault and violent assault. I objected to that last week. I felt that principles of jurisprudence which were in the public good were going to be eroded which made that action unjustified.
When we weigh these matters we have to be very careful. There are differences of opinion about how the rights and needs of society should be balanced. In my view, because I am convinced of the seriousness of this situation, we could and should be responsible for looking very closely at endorsing the proposals put forward by the hon. member who introduced this bill.
It is clear the present Criminal Code procedures are not doing the job needed. For example, money laundering techniques are becoming increasingly more sophisticated. It is very difficult for law enforcement officers to do the job that needs to be done and to keep on top of criminal activity and the results of it.
In terms of human misery, the activities of these criminal organizations simply cannot be allowed. It has to be vigorously combated by individuals in our country.
As the hon. member stated, the activities of these criminal organizations and the impact on other individuals in society, on our young people, on families, on our communities and on public safety in general is absolutely enormous and simply must be addressed. It must be faced squarely.
I believe in containing problems when they are small rather than waiting until we have a full blown crisis on our hands. It is my view that we should look seriously at the problem. Perhaps these proposals are not the whole answer but we should certainly be discussing and looking at them.
On August 18, 1995 the Minister of Justice in an article published in the Toronto Sun said: ``We should not assume another federal law will solve the problem''. Then on March 29, 1995 in statements which were printed in the Montreal Gazette , he talked about the federal government considering amending the Criminal Code with anti-biker legislation but he has done nothing about it.
Therefore, which is it? The justice minister needs to take some leadership on this issue. Certainly when other members try to take leadership, the last thing we need is to refuse to hear or even discuss their proposals. I am upset about this. I disagree strongly with the Liberal members who refused the unanimous consent necessary to allow this bill to even be discussed in the justice committee.
I believe this is something we should-