Mr. Speaker, in resuming the debate may I make the preparatory comment that one has been fascinated by the debate tonight. I point out to those trained in the great Cartesian tradition that balance and form are an integral part of its mode of reasoning. Therefore what we are suggesting here was in that full spirit.
This is an oceans act and it is not the proper forum to tack on American congressional style, other matters that are better dealt with elsewhere.
There is nothing in this debate that indicates the government regards the comments made opposite as irrelevant or not of importance and worth consideration. Surely they belong in another forum and we would welcome the members of the official opposition to co-operative federalism through federal-provincial discussions of the sort referred to by the hon. member for Chambly and bring these matters there.
In terms of the oceans act, it has its own integrity and it should be left with that. The references to clause 9(5) of the oceans act are misplaced. That is a simple interpretive provision. As a matter of law in the Latin sense it is inserted ex abundante cautela. It takes away no rights, it creates no rights. It is a simple provision of interpretation. It leaves the situation as it was before.
Getting back to the specific amendments now proposed by the Bloc, we would have to recognize that the government has applied multi-disciplinary approaches here. It looks to an integration of economic, environmental and social considerations and it seeks to involve all affected stakeholders.
Stewardship of the ocean and coastal resources is responsibilities we must all share, federal, territorial, provincial, municipal and aboriginal governments, in partnership with the larger community, the extended family, business, unions, non-government organizations and academics.
The government is prepared for the leadership role in oceans management and embraces the reality of co-operative stewardship and partnership.
Although the government is committed to collaboration with the provinces, as evidenced by its preambular statements in the Canada oceans act, the Bloc Quebecois proposed amendments such as Motions Nos. 24, 25, 26 and 27 which would require further consultation with the provinces and would obligate the review of decisions made by the governor in council by the standing committee.
This is a fundamental change in the structure of government that may well be worth considering in another forum. Everything is open to discussion in those terms, but it is the wrong approach to try and tack it on to the oceans act, which has its own integrity and its own purposes.
The Bloc amendments apply to other ministers and to the governor in council. To require the governor in council to consult with the provinces and with the standing committee before issuing a regulation recommended by another minister is in legal terms a preposterous proposal.
The Minister of Foreign Affairs will be making recommendations to the governor in council on the delineation of maritime zones. It is a question of international relations, not one of federal-provincial relations, as suggested by Bloc Motion No. 24.
The Minister of Justice will be making recommendations respecting the application of federal and provincial laws to the maritime zones of Canada.
Regulations respecting the application of federal and provincial laws to the maritime zones under the provisions of part I of the Canada Oceans Act are the responsibility of the Minister of Justice. It is not the role of the provinces or of the Standing Committee on Fisheries and Oceans to alter the responsibilities of either of these two ministers, or to interfere with the recommendations they make to the governor in council.
Further, Motion No. 39 proposes to require that the minister consult with the provinces and receive approval from the standing committee before establishing advisory or management bodies and appointing members to those bodies. The minister is already required to take the views of the provinces into account, so this motion in legal terms is redundant.
Again the Bloc is proposing that the minister's abilities to exercise his mandate be fettered, this time by proposing that the valuable time of the standing committee be taken away, time that is better spent representing the views and interests of Canadians.
In short, we have found the debate interesting and fruitful in terms of ideas. We do regard the amendments in essence as ones in which the Speaker could have exercised his discretion the other way, but we have made no proposal to that effect. I would suggest the thrust of these matters is not germane to the oceans act under consideration and would be better taken up in another forum at another time. And be assured this government is prepared to consider every proposal in those other fora.