Mr. Speaker, I would like to say it is a privilege to talk on Bill C-45 with regard to the amendment to section 745 of the Criminal Code.
I would like to say that, but it is really not a privilege. The fact is we should not be here talking about this amendment to section 745, the faint hope clause as it has become known. It really should have been repealed. To be standing here today talking about amendments from the Liberal government is really quite an insult.
If we were to talk to many of the people of the lower mainland of British Columbia and particularly in my riding, they would agree with what I say. Why did the government not repeal this section of the act?
Since it does not have the courage of the convictions of many people in this country, I will try to put in a wake-up call to the government and explain why it is necessary to repeal this part of the Criminal Code.
I may be the only MP in the House who has attended a parole board hearing for individuals who were put before a parole board hearing as a result of a federal review under section 745. That in itself may not be significant. However, what is significant are the circumstances by which I attended the parole board hearing for the two individuals who were released under section 745.
They killed a young RCMP officer in Cloverdale, British Columbia in the 1970s. They were sentenced to hang, until the Liberal government decided that hanging was a bad thing and decided that life, 25 years, would be a good thing with the possibility of getting out before 25 years. Lo and behold, at year 17 these individuals who killed that young police officer are now out on the streets.
One might say they had spent enough time in prison, perhaps they are sorry for what they did. They deliberately enticed a young 19-year old officer chase their car. They stopped their car, he got out of his car and they blew him away with a gun.
Before the parole hearing took place and after the judicial review, I was called by the sister of this young policeman who now
lives in Montreal today and his brother who lives in Vancouver. They told me: "We thought this was all behind us. We thought we were done with this and here we are once again sitting here listening and rehashing the horrible events that led to our young brother's death".
The constable's brother was sitting with me at the parole board hearing. He really made no input to the hearing, made no victim's impact statement and could not say how he really felt. His sister could not get to Abbotsford to the parole board hearing. She stayed in Montreal with bated breath waiting and hoping they would get their just sentence, life.
It turned out there was another policeman in the room who was a friend of the constable back in the 1970s. He just shook his head at what he heard. I think everybody in the room agreed that people had forgotten after all those years. It was such a big deal when this policeman was killed in the 1970s but now people had forgotten what it was all about.
Such are the problems with section 745, the faint hope clause. Those two individuals, cop killers as they were considered, who in earlier years would have been hanged or would have received life are now out. One is going to college.
I do not know what it will take to get this government to understand that first degree murderers are first degree murderers and that giving them an opportunity to get out as in the faint hope clause is only sentencing the victims to a lifelong series of events which never goes away.
For instance, you only have to talk to Sharon and Gary Rosenfeldt. I know people do not like to hear about Clifford Olson and nobody likes to talk about him and people like him. When you talk to Sharon Rosenfeldt she says: "What else can I do? The government is going ahead with all of these things. This guy has so many rights and privileges in a prison. We have to talk about it". Yet this government is talk, talk, talk but it does not listen.
There are many victims groups in this country which I have the privilege of knowing. They call this a revictimization. I do not think the Liberals understand that. What is the point of taking the victims, their families, their children and their brothers and sisters all through this time and time again?
If this government could only understand, for instance, the problems it has brought to bear on so many people with section 745 with regard to Olson. He flew at taxpayer expense from Alberta to British Columbia for a hearing. There are countless hundreds and thousands of people on the lower mainland who are appalled by this and yet the government sits blank and allows it to happen. That in itself is criminal in my opinion.
It is going to take the removal of the Liberals out of the House of Commons to make changes because they are not listening. There are probably 20,000 to 30,000 people who are ready to surround the building where Olson will have his federal hearing to give a statement. The member can laugh all right, but they will be there and they will give a statement and the member still will not do anything and will not understand, but they will speak out anyway.
Giving this glimmer of hope to these people is really the wrong thing. All the government is doing is giving them much more opportunity than the victims. We have talked about victim rights in the House. This government does not even know what victim rights are and it could not even speak to it if we asked anybody to stand up here in the House.
One says tsk, tsk. That is the insult you get from this Liberal government. Tsk, tsk. You have a Liberal laughing over here. I just do not understand. Breaks are given to some people.
Look at what Olson has done and the fact that he has in excess of 30 litigation cases against the crown. He is flown from hearing to hearing. He made tapes in his prison cell unknown to Correctional Service Canada. Steve Sullivan, executive director of the victims resource centre, wrote to the minister on March 1996 concerning those video tapes and the right to make them. Seven months have passed now and Correctional Service Canada did its own internal investigation and has been complete for a couple of months. It cannot get answers. Victims ask why this is being done.
When is this government really going to get the message? When is this government going to understand in the House of Commons that there are a lot of people out there hoping the right thing will be done?
In my riding there is a Liberal want to be, a guy pops up his head once in a while in our local newspapers who we beat in the last election. In the local newspaper he said: "It doesn't really matter anyway. A guy like Olson is not going to get a parole. He is going to get a federal hearing. He is going to use taxpayers' dollars for legal aid but he is not going to get out on parole, so don't worry about it".
Why are we spending all the money if in fact he is not getting out? Why would we not repeal the section if in fact they are not getting out anyway? What kind of sham is this, this cloak and dagger stuff the government pulls over on the people of Canada to show yes, it is going to do something about this faint hope clause; the government will deal toughly with it and the government cloaks it.
Why must we talk time after time in this House about sections within the Criminal Code? Why must we bring these events here to debate minor amendments when this government with the huge majority it has can do what is right and repeal it? That is an
interesting question for those who laugh and say tsk, tsk, for those who promise one thing and do another, for those who consider in this House on the Liberal side that criminal rights are more important than victims rights. Yes, members can shake their heads but that is what it amounts to.
I get one minute to tell the House what I think but we cannot say that on television. The difficulty anyone has coming to the House of Commons with a majority Liberal government is they do not do much of anything at all. There will be changes. I can assure the House if the government does not repeal section 745 and Olson shows up in Vancouver, we will be there. We will be there not with 10,000, not with 15,000 but with 20,000-plus people standing and telling Liberals just what they think of this Liberal government.