Madam Speaker, my comments are sparked in part by the last member who spoke and some of the other members who have spoken today, in particular those on the Liberal side.
I find it very ironic and kind of sad that they would stand and talk about Reform's plan when obviously they have never read it. They have never opened the book, or they read it and they chose to ignore it, to say things they know are not stated in the book and to ignore the things that really are there.
It is unfortunate they would prey on the fears of Canadians, those who have already retired and those approaching retirement, to try to sell a very bad plan of their own.
It has been mentioned today that it started at 5%. They were told it was a wonderful plan and that it would never go up. Now it is doubling from that early start.
I want to speak about one aspect of the plan, the impact of the raising of the payroll taxes to 9.9% on business, in particular small business.
Speaking again of false comments made by the government, its members seem to want to imply that Reform's plan is to scrap CPP and instead simply have people put their money into RRSPs.
Members who think like this are the ones who have not actually read the plan. The plan is an RRSP type system changed over from the existing Canada pension plan. It is not paid out of rich profits from a high paid job but in fact paid by the same deductions that are going into the Canada pension plan right now, money that has been squandered, money that has been spent and still results in a $600 billion liability on the part of the Canada pension plan. I just want to make sure people understand that.
I hope hon. members opposite listen to this example. I welcome heckling when I am speaking. I actually feed on it. Sometimes it gives me some good stuff to carry on with in my speech. When all their friends are away, I hope they get a chance to think of this one point personally and consider it from a non-partisan point of view.
Before I came to this place I had a small construction company that built about eight houses a year. During that time I was doing other things. My company, which was primarily myself, made a profit of about $6,500 per house.
I employed carpenters, plumbers, electricians, excavation people with their equipment, roofers, drywallers and any number of people. I bought supplies from people all over town and throughout my region. It was a good economic engine for the small community and the region I come from.
I had three people who virtually worked full time for me. If I consider the number of people who worked for me as I needed them for drywalling, roofing or some other components, it worked out to be the equivalent of about 10 full-time positions. It was as if I had 10 people full time who, if they had the particular talents, would have been able to do all the jobs. It would have created an annual income for those people.
According to the Liberal plan the wages I paid those people would be subject to this new payroll tax for the purpose of CPP. It would amount to $650 per head. What would be the impact on a small company?
As I said, I made about $6,500 a house and I had the equivalent of 10 full-time positions. As the employer my share would have been $650 times 10. The gross profit for one-eighth of my productivity as a builder would have gone to pay the increased CPP premiums.
When I had people working for me they liked to maintain some form of standard of living. They were pretty reasonable people. If I was still running my company and this increase came along, I suspect many of them would have come to me and said “We know times are tough. We know that the economy is tight. We are not looking for a raise but we certainly cannot afford a cut in pay. What we need is enough of a raise to pay the increase in our CPP premiums”.
They were hard workers. I would have been hard pressed not to have given it to them, but had I done so it would have been another $650 per employee for the equivalent of 10 full-time employees or $6,500, the gross profit from another house.
This was a viable small business and the increase in the Canada pension plan premium, a payroll tax, would have taken 25% of my gross profits from that construction company.
Government members will say that it is a government bill and they have to vote for it. I understand their dilemma. A member of the House who does not happen to belong to the Liberal Party any longer voted according to the way his conscience and his constituents directed him. Consequently he sits on this side of the House because the Liberal Party threw him out. They are not allowed to vote the way they think is in the best interests of Canadians in general or their constituents in particular.
I hope government members will raise this matter in caucus, speak to the minister and speak to the critics who deal with the Canada pension plan. If that is what would have happened to the small business I operated in Castlegar, in the interior of British Columbia, think what it will do to countless hundreds of thousands of businesses across the country.
The Liberals talk about job creation. How in God's name can jobs be created when they increase a payroll tax on people which will ultimately result in 25% of the profit from a small company going out the window? It will not work.
I hope that each of those members will say that they did not look at it from the point of view of employment. They are saying they looked at it from the point of view of rescuing the plan. There are much better ways to rescue the plan than simply throwing more money at it and in doing so destroying the economy of the country by destroying a lot of small businesses.
Instead of spouting the rhetoric thrown by the minister down to them they should read Reform's plan. It is an alternative. It is not the destruction of a pension plan. It is looking at it from the point of view that we have to ensure an income for people in their retirement and we have to make it affordable not only in terms of premiums but in job creation and sustainability. They look at it and say the 9.9% now will be the be all and end all to save the plan. It is the same thing that Liberals of days gone by said when it was brought in at 5%.
I hope my speech gives the Liberals something to think about. I appreciate the attention Liberal members have paid and I truly hope they will reconsider this in a non-partisan manner. If they do, I promise that I will not try and roast them by saying they were wrong. I will congratulate them on their re-examination and their concern for Canadians instead of just following the rhetoric of a few.