Mr. Speaker, I would be happy to speak on that variance and the winner-loser concept in normal labour negotiations as well.
One of the problems that occurs is that when we talk in terms of the power of the union moving from the oppressed to, in some cases-and I stress not all of them but a few certain unions-the oppressor deals with whether or not we are in an inflationary time or are we recessionary time.
In an inflationary time the unions are very powerful. As my colleague from Capilano-Howe Sound said, when this cash flow is coming in the unions can demand a larger portion of it. Those are the times when the unions say they want more. They may be justified in saying that in some cases because they took it on the chin during the last recessionary time, but right now we are in a recessionary time. The companies are saying that it is now their turn. They are saying that they can now drive the union wages down, ask for concessions, ask for cuts and ask people to do twice as much work with half as many people. They can ask for all kinds of things. It does not mean they are always going to get it but they can ask.
Curiously, my colleague from Wetaskiwin made a comment on the fact that I have taken the time to go out and speak to the unions. The results that I have received from these discussions are that there is always a bit of hesitation about something new and different. We all have that. It goes into every aspect of our life.
However, union members are saying it has some merit. They are interested in it because most of them are looking for a reasonable alternative to going on strike, losing wages and the problems associated with their families. They do not like putting companies in jeopardy which, in some cases, strikes do.
Interestingly, because we are in a recessionary period, when I go to the companies and talk to them, the larger companies say they are not really sure if they like that. They think the system is working just fine because the pendulum happens to be at a certain point. One thing about a pendulum, it continues to move back and forth.
There is no right time in the future. The right time to make these kind of changes is now. If we wait until the companies say yes, the pendulum is over here now and we can do it. Then the unions will be saying no. It has to be brought in. In the long term I believe both companies and unions will benefit from it. Unions will still have the full right of collective bargaining.
All we are changing is the final dispute mechanism. Companies will have the surety of knowing when they sign a contract they will be able to fulfil the contract and that any change in the conditions of employment for the workers will be dictated by the marketplace, by the ability of the company to pay, by similar wages in comparable industries, all the different factors that can be put in. All kinds of safeguards can be put into this and that is the direction we have to move.
I welcome the question from my colleague but I am disappointed that I did not hear comments from the other side suggesting that they would look favourably on some of the things we have been talking about today.