Yes, as my colleague puts out, it is to try the victims. It is to upset them. It is to keep every victim off balance. That is the message they are getting. Why should we, as parliamentarians, allow that to happen?
When this issue came forward many months ago, in fact many years ago if we look at section 745, which was implemented over 15 years ago by a Liberal government, why were there not outcries from every parliamentarian? There was not. The Liberal Party is content to leave it that way. It is content to keep the victims in our society on edge, off balance and constantly suffering.
There is a point of justice and I do not believe that it is being delivered as it should be by the Liberal government with the legislation which it has brought forward. In spite of the fact that the Liberals have been told time and again, they refuse to make any adjustment.
I believe that in section 745 hearings the statements are very important. At the most recent hearing which I attended we heard the statements of other witnesses. This case concerned Mr. Glaremin. If the victim's impact statement can be altered, what about other witness statements which are issued?
Expert testimony was granted at Glaremin's trial. However, it was not from an expert. It was from a paraphrased condensed version that the court allowed to be entered and allowed the jury to read. In other words, somebody had already altered it. It was supposed to be from the expert witnesses. There was no opportunity for even the crown to cross-examine it. This is absolute nonsense.
The killer was then up on the stand giving his evidence. What was he saying? Was he telling the jury how he felt? Absolutely. Was his statement altered or edited by the judge? No way. He could even reconstruct the events that brought about his conviction.
There may have been some objection on the part of the crown in reference to that point, but he said it and the witnesses were not around to say otherwise because the trial was long gone. It had been 15 years ago. Here again was the opportunity for the jury to hear a very sanitized version of what had really happened. That is what happens at a section 745 hearing.
We should not be talking about just a single statement. This omnibus bill, C-17, should strike section 745 and clear it right off the books. That is where it should end. First degree, premeditated murderers should be subject to the most severe of penalties, not some opportunity for involving parliamentarians in a debate on whether a statement is good or not or that the murderer could get out earlier. First degree, premeditated murderers should be subject to the most severe of penalties.
I have had several victims in my office over the last little while. The consensus right now is not to have anything done with section 745 but to bring back the death penalty. That is the comment and the desire, I would suggest, on the part of a number of Canadians. I would suggest that number is very high. People want section 745 gone but they also do not ever want killers let out. Not only should life mean life but the ultimate penalty is now being discussed in an even broader context.
However, this is not on the lips of the Liberal members. The death penalty is not a item that will ever be brought to the floor by the Liberals.
Reform's position on the death penalty is that we would like to see it brought to the people in the form of a binding national referendum for first degree, premeditated murderers. That is really the way to deal with the issue. Who wants to entrust it to elected representatives who refuse to do what the people want? Give it back to the people and let them decide. If the issue should be brought forward then so be it, it will be brought forward.
We could go on and on about section 745 because this issue will never die. There are some 600 possible applications coming up under this section. I think that is to what Canadians should really pay attention. The pressure should come on the federal government, the Liberal government. It brought this section in and it is up to the Liberals to get rid of it. If not then they should be voted out of office.