Debates of Feb. 19th, 1998

Bill C-28

[Rob Anders, Reform, Calgary West, AB]

Mr. Speaker, in their first red book the Liberals promised that they would not follow Brian Mulroney's ethical example. They said they would appoint an ethics commissioner who would report directly to parliament.

Well, they did not. Their so-called ethics counsellor reports in secret to the Prime Minister. Scandal after scandal and the ethics counsellor always has enough whitewash for the job.

I have a question. What is the use of an ethics counsellor if he just rubber stamps the finance minister's unethical behaviour?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the counsellor was in front of a committee of the House Tuesday and he replied to the question. He did not refuse to go there. He said very clearly that there was no conflict of interest.

Opposition members are desperate. They cannot find anything to attack the government so they are trying to attack the integrity of a person who cannot be attacked because he has proven that he is a very competent and honest Minister of Finance.

Reference To Supreme Court

[Michel Bellehumeur, Bloc, Berthier—Montcalm, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Justice. No, the Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs. No, the Prime Minister of Canada.

[Some hon. members]

Ha, ha.

[Michel Bellehumeur, Bloc, Berthier—Montcalm, QC]

Yesterday, the Fédération des communautés francophones et acadienne du Canada criticized the federal government's reference. Today, it is the turn of the National Action Committee on the Status of Women. In addition, Mike Harris, the Ontario premier, is openly criticizing the federal government's strategy. The list of those opposing the reference is growing longer.

What is the Prime Minister's response to the remarks by Mike Harris and I quote: “Regardless of what the lawyers say, this is going to get us nowhere”?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the Supreme Court is considering the matter. The lawyers are arguing before it. The court will examine the matter and give its decision. I respect the court and leave it to do its job.

If the Bloc Quebecois has so many arguments, why was it afraid to send a lawyer to represent it before the Supreme Court?

[Michel Bellehumeur, Bloc, Berthier—Montcalm, QC]

Mr. Speaker, it seems that Ottawa has fewer and fewer arguments.

Quebec says no. Mike Harris says no. Francophones outside Quebec say no. Women's groups in Canada say no. Many other people say no to the federal government's reference.

Will the Prime Minister acknowledge that this course of action has everyone on board a veritable constitutional Titanic ?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the no that counts is the no of democracy expressed in two referendums when the people of Quebec said no to separation and yes to Canada.

Taxation

[Chuck Strahl, Reform, Fraser Valley, BC]

Mr. Speaker, what is fascinating about this ongoing saga that we are discussing today is that it has shed some light on the finance minister's shipping company.

Mr. Speaker, did you know that one of the finance minister's big ships, the Atlantic Erie is actually registered in the Bahamas? That is not illegal but it says a lot about taxes in this country. Taxes are so high that the finance minister registers his ships where the taxes are lower.

It may be true that it is better in the Bahamas, but will the finance minister ever lower taxes for ordinary Canadians so that ordinary Canadians get tax relief and not just those who can register their ships in a foreign country?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, we have already done it in the last budget, reducing taxes. We did it on January 1 when we reduced the contribution to the employment insurance program. Hopefully there might be more next Tuesday, but I am not to tell you if I know, and I don't know if I can tell you.

[Grant McNally, Reform, Dewdney—Alouette, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I think the Prime Minister is missing the point here. It is no joke that the finance minister is avoiding his own taxes by registering his ships offshore. By flying the flag of the Bahamas instead of the Canadian flag the finance minister's company saves a lot of tax dollars.

I have a question for the Prime Minister on behalf of my constituents. If they raise the Bahamian or the Liberian flag, can they pay less taxes too?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, it is obvious that the members on the other side are very jealous of the success of the Minister of Finance.

Iraq

[Daniel Turp, Bloc, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Foreign Affairs.

In a letter sent a few days ago to Canadian nationals in Lebanon, Ambassador Daniel Marchand implies that they ought to be prepared to withstand a siege or to evacuate the country, because of the imminent armed conflict with Iraq.

From this initiative by the ambassador, are we to conclude that the minister considers armed conflict with Iraq not only inevitable, but also liable to spread throughout the entire region?

[Lloyd Axworthy, Liberal, Minister of Foreign Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, we have already issued an advisory to Canadian citizens about the actions they should take in preparation. We want them to keep in very close contact with all the embassies. We have alerted our warden system in the area and we are preparing contingency plans.

We monitor the situation virtually every day with all the departments involved. I can promise the House and all Canadians that we will keep them up to date and give them the best information possible to ensure their security.

Assistance To Ice Storm Victims

[Claude Drouin, Liberal, Beauce, QC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Human Resources Development.

Our government has already provided substantial financial assistance to individuals and businesses affected by the ice storm. There are, however, others who are not eligible for assistance but who wish to contribute to the reconstruction.

Can our government tell us whether any special measures will be contemplated to assist people who do not meet the criteria but wish to help?

[Pierre Pettigrew, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development]

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to announce today that another $5 million will be added to the disaster relief fund administered by my department, thus raising it to $50 million.

The additional $5 million will allow still greater flexibility to employers, so that they may hire people who are not eligible for employment insurance or youth employment programs, but could help in the reconstruction.

To date, the Government of Canada has already paid ice storm victims a total of $270 million, with more to come.

Bill C-28

[John Williams, Reform, St. Albert, AB]

Mr. Speaker, we have heard the Prime Minister defend the Minister of Finance in this debacle regarding Bill C-28. We have heard him say that it is the secretary of state who is handling the file. Bill C-28 says it is the Minister of Finance who sponsored the bill. Do we believe this stuff or do we treat it with contempt? Which is it?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I have explained that it is an omnibus bill and that this clause was handled by the secretary of state.

Under the present system, the finance bill has to be tabled under the name of the Minister of Finance. It was clearly established that if there was to be any tax change affecting this industry, the Minister of Finance was not to be briefed by his officials and that the problem was to be handled by the secretary of state for finance. It was the prudent thing to do, to agree with the ethics counsellor.

It is clear that the Minister of Finance followed all the rules.

Firearms Regulations

[Jim Pankiw, Reform, Saskatoon—Humboldt, SK]

Mr. Speaker, Canada has chaired four UN workshops on firearms regulations. Twice I requested that the Minister of Foreign Affairs grant me observer status at these workshops. Both times he denied my request, each time for a different reason. He went on to say that information and access could be obtained if I joined a special interest group. Why does the minister place special interest groups ahead of elected representatives of the Canadian people?

[Lloyd Axworthy, Liberal, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member has already received his answer in a letter but I am quite happy to repeat it to him again. The fact is that these working groups are working groups of experts who are brought together. They do not include political people. We told him that we would keep him informed.

Bill C-28

[Nelson Riis, NDP, Kamloops, BC]

Mr. Speaker, a few days ago, the Deputy Prime Minister said that Bill C-28 does not apply to Canada Steamship Lines. Later the executive director of the tax legislation division of the Department of Finance said yes, these provisions would be available to Canada Steamship Lines. Whose opinion is accurate in this case?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Deputy Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member is not quoting either Mr. Farber or myself correctly.

The bill itself only applies to companies not incorporated in Canada. Canada Steamship Lines I understand is not incorporated in Canada.

What Mr. Farber was referring to was the possibility of a company not now incorporated in Canada going through the expense and trouble of changing its structure. Therefore there is no contradiction.

Once again, I have proven that the NDP has nothing to complain about regarding the economic policies of this government because they cannot find one question to raise about—

[The Speaker]

The hon. member for Winnipeg North Centre.

Health Care

[Judy Wasylycia-Leis, NDP, Winnipeg North Centre, MB]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Health. For the first time in the history of medicare, deaths are occurring directly as a result of health care cuts and the blood is on his hands.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.