Debates of March 17th, 1998

The Senate

[Deborah Grey, Reform, Edmonton North, AB]

Mr. Speaker, we are not accusing the Prime Minister of doing anything illegal with those things back then. We are just asking questions now about the fact that just last week in the House of Commons the Prime Minister said he received no remuneration. In fact he got $45,000 in one week.

What we want to ask is this: What is the problem with the Prime Minister saying “Sure, here is a Senate seat for you” a few years later. Was this $45,000 not a downpayment on a Senate seat, yes or no?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, a few months ago the hon. member made an accusation against me about my riding and she had the company completely wrong. It was a company from Winnipeg and she did not know the difference between Winnipeg and Shawinigan.

I am still waiting for the hon. member's apology because she misled both the House and the nation.

[The Speaker]

Let us be very judicious in our questions and our answers please.

[Deborah Grey, Reform, Edmonton North, AB]

Mr. Speaker, we are taking our facts from the insider trading reports. The Prime Minister knows exactly where he got the cash, how much he bought the shares for and how much he sold them for just one week later.

Air Canada, Canadian Airlines and the Prime Minister all seem to offer seat sales, but there is only one of those that flies straight to the Senate.

Let me ask the Prime Minister this. The swearing in ceremony is going on right now, at 2 o'clock. Will he cancel his Senate appointment while there is still time?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, certainly not. I am delighted that he will be a senator and he will represent British Columbia in Ottawa better than any member of the Reform Party.

Semaine Nationale De La Francophonie

[Gilles Duceppe, Bloc, Laurier—Sainte-Marie, QC]

Mr. Speaker, in a letter dated March 5, the president of the Association canadienne d'éducation de langue française accuses the heritage department of trying to use the Semaine de la francophonie to serve its own ends.

He wrote as follows: “The heritage department feels that it is legitimate to appropriate the week and to alter it to suit its own exaggerated need for visibility”.

What does the Minister of Canadian Heritage have to say in response to the president of the ACELF's accusation that she is appropriating the Semaine nationale de la francophonie in order to raise the government's profile?

[Sheila Copps, Liberal, Minister of Canadian Heritage]

Mr. Speaker, this year's contracts to the ACELF were in the same amount as those awarded in previous years.

[Gilles Duceppe, Bloc, Laurier—Sainte-Marie, QC]

We were not disputing the amount. We were questioning those who received it.

The ACELF president, Mr. Bordeleau, speaks out against what he calls, and I will repeat his exact words, “the heritage department's exaggerated need for visibility”.

Does the minister realize that she is insulting francophones, offending them, just to satisfy her burning need for visibility?

[Sheila Copps, Liberal, Minister of Canadian Heritage]

Mr. Speaker, if anyone is trying to make political hay at the expense of francophones, it is the Government of Quebec.

The Quebec minister of the day never supported francophones in getting the Jeux de la Francophonie for Canada. He even wrote saying they ought not to come here, but he had a change of heart this week because it is the Semaine de la Francophonie.

[Michel Gauthier, Bloc, Roberval, QC]

Mr. Speaker, we are going to set the record straight for the Minister of Canadian Heritage.

In a letter dated March 5, the president of the Association canadienne d'éducation de langue française, Louis-Gabriel Bordeleau, said, and I quote “Less than a month before the event, greatly disappointed and with reluctance, we had to let the private firm of Leroux Rhéal & Associés use our trademarks until March 31 in exchange for a grant from the Department of Canadian Heritage”.

What explanation does the minister have for resorting to such blackmail?

[Sheila Copps, Liberal, Minister of Canadian Heritage]

Mr. Speaker, I clearly explained to the leader of the third party—

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Saint-Maurice, QC]

Soon to be the sixth.

[Sheila Copps, Liberal, Hamilton East, ON]

—that the contract amounts were exactly the same as last year and the year before.

As for recognition of francophones in Canada, I am proud that my colleague, the member for Moncton, is working with all francophone and francophile colleagues in the House to ensure that the visibility of francophones, here in the House and across Canada, is greater than in the past.

[Michel Gauthier, Bloc, Roberval, QC]

Mr. Speaker, to say to someone “I will give it to you only if you do this against your will” is blackmail and that is what the minister did with respect to the Association canadienne d'éducation de langue française.

[The Speaker]

I would ask the hon. member not to use the piece of paper as a prop. I give the floor back to the hon. member.

[Michel Gauthier, Bloc, Roberval, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I can say it out loud because it pains us to see the Minister of Canadian Heritage resorting to blackmail.

How can she justify “I will give you a grant if you do this against your will”? It is revolting. What does she have to say?

[Sheila Copps, Liberal, Minister of Canadian Heritage]

Mr. Speaker, the remarks of the member opposite are completely false. If ever anyone did a flip-flop, I would like to recall what the Hon. Sylvain Simard wrote, and I quote “As for the Jeux de la Francophonie, the uncertainty that hung over the Madagascar games, and that, in some respects, still hangs over them, calls into question the very model of the games”.

He was against the Jeux de la Francophonie, but now he is indulging in petty politics, and that is scandalous.

Multilateral Agreement On Investment

[Alexa McDonough, NDP, Halifax, NS]

Mr. Speaker, to date, Canadians have heard not a peep, pas un mot, from the Prime Minister about the MAI. Not a peep.

Last week European parliamentarians representing 15 different nations voted overwhelmingly, 437 to 8, to reject the current MAI proposal because of the undemocratic nature of the negotiations.

Will the Prime Minister today show the same respect for democracy, commit to full public debate and cross-Canada hearings and allow Canadians to decide the fate of the MAI and the future of our country?

[Julian Reed, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to Minister for International Trade]

Mr. Speaker, I am disappointed that the council of Barlow cancelled a meeting with ministry officials and me last week. I am disappointed that the council of Barlow has chosen not to take advice, not to look for advice from the chief negotiator of the MAI.

I point out to the leader of the NDP that a full debate was held in this House on February 23 on this very subject. I would suggest to her that she advise the council of Barlow that all of the information and all the—

[The Speaker]

The hon. leader of the New Democratic Party.

[Alexa McDonough, NDP, Halifax, NS]

Mr. Speaker, once again absolute silence from the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister sits in his seat, dumb as an oyster.

How can any self-respecting Prime Minister consider signing an agreement with such massive implications to Canadians without first consulting them? This deal could rob Canadians of our ability to make our own decisions about our health care, our environment, our resources, and our very culture. Our sovereignty is at stake.

Instead of his stony silence, will the Prime Minister withdraw Canada from the MAI negotiations, until and unless he has the—

[The Speaker]

The right hon. Prime Minister.

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I agree entirely with the very able parliamentary secretary who gave a very good answer.

We are negotiating there and we are consulting here in Canada. We have debated the issue in the House of Commons and we will be consulting. The deal is not tomorrow. We will not sign a bad deal. We will always be sure that Canadians are present in the world. If we follow the policies of isolation of the NDP, Canada will go nowhere.

Pensions

[Elsie Wayne, Progressive Conservative, Saint John, NB]

Mr. Speaker, the finance minister had an opportunity during his budget speech to tell Canadians that he has heard their concerns regarding the proposed seniors benefit plan, but he blew it, for he was silent.

Why does the finance minister continue to push ahead with his idea of clawing back Canadians' retirement savings by 70%?

[Paul Martin, Liberal, Minister of Finance]

Mr. Speaker, we have made it very clear that over the last two years we have consulted with Canadians. There will be changes brought down based on the principles that have been set forth.

The hon. member asks why we want to proceed. We want to proceed in order to assure Canadians of whatever age that they will have a secure and safe retirement.