Mr. Speaker, it is a pleasure for me to speak to Bill C-26. As outlined by the parliamentary secretary, it is an act to amend the Canada Grain Act and the Agriculture and Agri-Food Administrative Monetary Penalties Act and to repeal the Grain Futures Act.
I challenge government members across the floor to truly and carefully listen to what farmers have to say about Bill C-26. The parliamentary secretary spoke long and eloquently about the consultative process that led up to Bill C-26, but I believe the job is only half done.
While it is true the government has a dismal track record when it comes to listening to either farmers or the Canadian people, I believe it has a chance to partially redeem itself through the legislation. On behalf of farmers I encourage the government to seize that opportunity.
They have a chance to seriously consider concerns that producers of special crops have about this very complex bill. After all, that is what MPs are supposed to be doing here. Reformers place very heavy emphasis on consultation and feedback from Canadians. Reformers base their policies on what voters have indicated are their wishes. We consult, listen and then we consult again. The result is a product that provides the most accurate reflection of the will of the people ever seen in the Chamber.
Consensus building is never easy but it will always produce better legislation than simply responding to lobbyists, special interest groups or bureaucrats, which seems to be the Liberal method of drafting policy. The parliamentary secretary referred to the consultations he believes and the government believes have taken place, but I believe the job is not yet done.
It is high time Liberal MPs gave this process a try. I realize it is a little against their natural tendencies but they might be surprised to find some pleasure out of newly found democratic ways. From personal experience I can attest it is a great feeling to know one is accurately reflecting the views of constituents and those of Canadians.
It is due to this need for feedback and consultation that Reform MPs have given tentative support to Bill C-26. I describe that support as tentative because it is in the early days yet. The debate and analysis of the legislation has only just begun.
While at the outset it appears as though parts of the legislation may reap positive results in the form of increased financial security for producers of special crops, we have yet to hear from the majority of those producers and from other stakeholders affected by the legislation. We have yet to hear from the majority of producers of beans, buckwheat, corn, faba beans, lentils, mustard seed, peas, safflower seed, soybeans, sunflower seed and triticale. The same goes for any other party, and there are other parties, that feel the legislation will touch them as well.
It is members of these groups who are the experts. We must listen to their expert opinions on how Bill C-26 will affect their livelihoods. I have personally written to a number of these groups which represent special crops farmers asking them to send me their praise or their criticisms of the bill. I have also sent an open letter to the editor of the Western Producer inviting persons affected by the legislation to share their views with me. Hopefully it will find room in its next publication to print my appeal for input.
This will kick-start a process of consultation, an ongoing process that I am confident will result in some concrete proposals to actually improve Bill C-26. This consultative process must be given the opportunity to achieve results. That means that when the bill goes to the Standing Committee on Agriculture and Agri-Food all members of that committee must be ready and willing to give sufficient time and opportunity for witnesses to come forward with their opinions and proposals.
Unfortunately this is not something we simply expect to happen. It should be something we should be able to expect as part of our democratic parliamentary process. However the government has shown us time and time again that this process can be manipulated and mutilated to the point that democracy can barely be seen.
For those who are unfamiliar with the sad story of Bill C-4, I will tell them how that bill was rammed through committee stage. Grain farmers and farm groups whose livelihoods depend upon reform of the Canadian Wheat Board were given less than two weeks, or just six short meetings in Ottawa, to tell MPs on the agriculture committee what was wrong with Bill C-4. They were lumped together, up to four at a time, in a round table style presentation. These stakeholders who have the right to have their views heard by elected representatives were barely squeezed in to the Liberal members' agenda and once they were before the committee their comments were virtually ignored and their expertise was disregarded.
Reform MPs on the committee, including myself, collectively had just seven minutes to question witnesses to garner a complete understanding of their position. By the time the sixth and final committee meeting allotted for Bill C-4 came along, it was apparent that Liberal committee members had no intention of making any of the substantive changes required.
In less than two hours the entire bill was analysed clause by clause and returned to the House, not as improved legislation that reflected farmer feedback but as the same ineffective unanimously despised bill that was tabled by the minister responsible for the wheat board in the first place.
Since it had been immediately apparent that amendments would not be given fair consideration at committee, my Reform colleagues and I chose to table our amendments at report stage, hoping that all MPs in the House would take the time to thoroughly consider them.
What did the Liberals think of the amendments that were derived by farmers? They thought they were a waste of time. The government invoked time allocation and cut off debate on Bill C-4. Consultation was certainly not to get in the way of the government's tight schedule.
You can understand, Mr. Speaker, why I challenge government members to truly consult with farmers on Bill C-26. I am understandably sceptical. I am concerned for farmers. I am concerned that their voices will be ignored as they were during the debate on Bill C-4.
At this point I have little doubt that my Reform colleagues and I will be proposing amendments to Bill C-26 either at the agriculture committee or at report stage in the Chamber. Certain problems with the bill are already apparent through the limited feedback we have received thus far. As I mentioned, even if the government is not ready to consult with farmers Reformers are.
I am looking forward to the responses to my invitation to comment on Bill C-26. Based on those responses if the majority of farmers support the bill we will know it. If the majority of farmers oppose the bill we will also know that.
I have a number of preliminary concerns about Bill C-26 that I believe should be addressed in coming days along with the concerns we will hear from farmers. One of the most worrisome aspects of Bill C-26, which I hope can be addressed through amendments, is the lack of details outlining how the special crops industry insurance plan will function. Instead of having these details put in place by parliament, meaning that they will undergo the scrutiny and debate of MPs and farmers, regulations will be put in place. Regulations are not subjected to the consultation and approval required for legislation.
Passing Bill C-26 with the details of the insurance plan missing is like signing a blank cheque. I am not prepared to sign off the legislation without at least setting up some essential parameters for the operation of the insurance plan. Perhaps the government felt this task is too onerous or too complicated to be included in the bill.
I assure the government and the minister of agriculture that producers of special crops will be willing to meet that challenge. There is too much at stake to avoid the particulars and leave them to be determined through regulations. Farmers' interests need to be protected.
For example, the insurance levy requires limitations. The special crops rural initiative program or SCRIP committee, which includes producers and processors from the three prairie provinces, made a number of recommendations in the April 1996 report, many of which are contained in the bill as the parliamentary secretary outlined. However, the SCRIP committee recommended that the insurance levy remain under 1% of the gross value of grain sale proceeds but there is no clause to reflect this limit in Bill C-26.
I cannot be content nor can farmers to rely on the minister's word or assurances that in future regulations the levy will not surpass 1%. Bill C-26 requires more certainty on this issue and on many other particulars of the insurance plan.
Another concern arises from experiences that tell us that government interference in agriculture can often be a hindrance to progress. Bureaucracy and farming do not mix. Whenever possible, the market and the private sector must be allowed to determine an industry's direction. There are two examples in this legislation that run opposite to this philosophy.
The first is that the Canadian Grain Commission will run the insurance plan. Perhaps during the formative months that the plan is being established the CGC could play a stabilizing role as administrator. However, there is no reason that legislation should not call for the eventual return of the plan to one of the producer groups. The insurance plan runs the risk of becoming bogged down in the infamous government bureaucracy.
In a related issue, the insurance plan is insured by the Export Development Corporation, a federal government institution. Why not allow a private insurance company to act as the insurer? It is an option that must be investigated. It is often found that private companies have premiums competitive to premiums charged by the federal government to ensure an insurance plan. If that is the case then farmers and taxpayers would be better off if a private company were chosen.
The Reform Party favours fostering the development of private sector management strategies in the Canadian agricultural industry. We need less government interference in agriculture. We need to support an increase in private enterprise.
Further concerns will no doubt arise over the levy. The CGC says the initial levy will be set at .0038 or almost four-tenths of 1% which is slightly higher than the SCRIP committee had originally suggested. There will be questions about this increase in the levy. The CGC also says that one-third of the levy will be consumed by administrative costs and two-thirds will go toward the premium on the fund. Minimizing the administrative costs will be a priority for farmers and Reform MPs. It has also been suggested that the deductible be set at 20%.
I remind everyone that all these figures mentioned are not in the legislation. They were either contained in the SCRIP report or in a press release issued by the CGC and this gives cause for great concern. While it may be difficult to specify precise numbers and percentages, farmers will want some assurance through legislation that rigid guidelines are in place to prevent the plan from becoming too expensive or too administratively burdened.
Even though levy rates deductibles are not found in any clause in Bill C-26 government MPs better be prepared to accept the reality that producers and processors will demand the opportunity to discuss them. They will not be willing to leave the fate of their livelihoods to be determined solely by regulation.
I refer to some of the feedback that has come. This legislation is really in its infancy even though there has been a consultative process under way for quite some time. This legislation is quite new to this place. Despite what the parliamentary secretary indicated during his remarks, I found many producers are not really aware that this legislation even exists at this point. We have some feedback coming to us about Bill C-26. I would like to read into the record a couple of letters I have received from groups.
The first is from the Foam Lake marketing club, a group of producers from Foam Lake, Saskatchewan.
In a February 19, 1998 letter to the minister on Bill C-26 they say:
We are very concerned with the SCRIP portion of Bill C-26 and as such, request that it be withdrawn for further study or substantially amended. Our request is supported by the following points:
1) There appears to have been a calculated effort by the CGC and the SCRIP committee to develop their proposal in secret.
This is quite contrary to the opening remarks of the parliamentary secretary about the great consultative process that the government went through.
There are very few farmers who know that the SCRIP bill is about to become law, let alone know the contents.
2) There have been several large membership organizations which have rejected SCRIP at their annual meetings, (1) the Saskatchewan Canola Growers Association, (2) the Western Canadian Wheat Growers Association, (3) the Saskatchewan Pulse Crop Development Board and (4) the Western Barley Growers Association.
3) The SCRIP proposal, while being promoted as voluntary, is nothing short of a worst case example of negative billing. This of course could be made acceptable if it was made truly voluntary for both the special crop growers and the grain dealers.
4) The key reason for the various commodity groups rejecting the SCRIP proposal was the suggestion in the CGC briefing notes that cereal and oilseed crops may well be added at a later date. It is obvious from this that the federal government is anxious to absolve itself of the security responsibilities which are clearly spelled out in the Canada Grain Act.
On point 4, I believe the author is talking about this bill as being more unloading, more downloading of government responsibilities to the producers. The letter goes on:
5) The other very troubling aspect of this proposal (which is left up to the regulators) is the fact that farmers will be paying a tax rather than a competitive cost item which would normally be built into the grain buyer's basis. Our industry has far too many regulated cost items which are void of any competitive forces.
What the author is referring to is competition. There should be open competition. Any time we get a situation where we have only one person supplying the insurance for an industry, without competition, we run the risk that the premiums and administration costs could be to high.
6) The final concern we would like to raise with you is the recent aggression which has been initiated by the CGC. Special crops dealers have indicated to us there have been a number of instances where the CGC has instructed the RCMP to seize records and close businesses down. These RCMP raids would appear to be linked directly to the SCRIP legislation. We urge you, Mr. Minister, to call off these scare tactics and allow the special crops industry to advance and prosper as it has done without the onerous regulations which are inherent in the grain industry in western Canada.
The Foam Lake Marketing Club is a group of 20 commercial farmers who meet on a regular basis to keep abreast of commodity market trends and advance our vision for a less regulated and a more market responsive agriculture industry in western Canada.
We trust you will respect our recommendation for withdrawal of SCRIP or make the necessary amendments to have it completely voluntary.
Sincerely,
Bill Cooper, President
I briefly want to refer to another copy of a letter that came to me from the Western Canadian Wheat Growers Association. It is also about this particular legislation. As I indicated, we are starting to get some feedback about Bill C-26.
This letter states:
Dear Minister:
Re: an act to amend the Canada Grain Act and the Agriculture and Agri-Food Administrative Monetary Penalties Act and to the repeal the Grain Futures Act
I am writing today specifically on the issue of the Special Crops Rural Initiative Program (SCRIP) proposed under Bill C-26. The attached resolution, passed by delegates to the Western Canadian Wheat Growers Association (WCWGA) annual meeting earlier this year, clearly spells out the position of our association on this program. Similar resolutions were also passed by delegates to the Saskatchewan Pulse Crop Development Board, Saskatchewan Canola Growers Association and the Western Barley Growers Association this year.
Since the passage of the resolution, the WCWGA took the initiative to meet with the Canadian Grain Commission (CGC) President Barry Senft and his staff as well as several members of the SCRIP committee to discuss our members' concerns. Our primary concern with the program is with the insurance plan. The mandatory payment of the levy at source is, in our opinion, a form of negative billing, and will be perceived as a tax on the farm community. We would therefore suggest that the program be amended to ensure participation in the program is truly voluntary for both the special crop grower and the special crop dealer.
It goes on in that light. Another concern he refers to is on page 2:
Because a significant number of wheat grower members are growers of special crops, we are also compelled to comment on the fact that the CGC is considering including cereal and oilseed crops in this program. If in fact the proposed legislation is all encompassing and only requires regulatory additions to include wheat, other cereals, and oilseeds, then we must demand that the SCRIP section of Bill C-26 be repealed.
That letter was signed by Larry Maguire, president of the Western Canadian Wheat Growers Association.
As I noted during my remarks, what we have seen is some feedback already starting to filter back.
I am not sure I can wrap up before question period. I have some other stories I would like to relate concerning this legislation.
One of the concerns about this legislation and the fact that there is a need to have insurance and bonds posted by grain dealers, in this case special crops dealers, is that farmers always run the risk of having their product sold to a company that goes bankrupt. The farmer is then left on the hook. Unfortunately we have seen that happen a few times.
I was told about a case where a company called Klemmer Seeds in Saskatchewan a couple of years ago went into receivership and some farmers were left on the hook and government and taxpayers had to come to their assistance.
Those of involved in agriculture and follow the agricultural industry are very well aware of what happened in the last week or so with Palliser Grain going into receivership.
Reform MPs from Saskatchewan showed great initiative recently by holding and hosting an open forum. They invited farmers from Saskatoon, Saskatchewan and approximately 300 showed up. I was also at this forum and spoke to the farmers. Many of the farmers approached me with concerns about Palliser Grain going into receivership. Their immediate concern was for the grain the company had in storage.
I would just like to give a bit of an indication of the magnitude of the disaster. I had a couple of farmers tell me that they were unfortunately in a position where they had eight carloads of flax that they had unloaded sometime last fall. The value of this, to put this in some perspective for a reasonably mid sized farm, is about $200,000. This flax was with Palliser and they are unclear at this point, because they had opted for a deferred payment, whether they are going to be covered by the bond that Palliser was carrying.