Mr. Speaker, I was anxious to have an exchange of views with the Liberal member on this.
First of all, she spoke of law 101. Well, we are also going to tell her about politics 101, because she said that the Government of Quebec had been consulted. The fact that the Quebec bar association or the Conseil du Patronat spoke out in committee does not mean that the Government of Quebec was consulted. There is a difference between the Quebec bar association, the Conseil du Patronat, the CSN and the government.
The government is a different institution, one elected democratically by the people and representing Quebecers. That is my first point.
Second, she says we were wrong when we said that this was a provincial jurisdiction. I have here a letter from the Quebec bar association to the Minister of Industry, who is with us today, and will read something from the end of its third paragraph. She can discuss it with the bar association, since she is a member. The letter reads:
But the protection of personal information is based on provincial jurisdiction over property, under the civil code.
I would imagine that a nice little discussion between bar association colleagues will ensue, since it is the association's opinion that this is an area of provincial jurisdiction.
The letter is fairly recent, February 4, 1999. I imagine they took into consideration the British North America Act, which has been around for more than a hundred years.
Continuing with this letter, because it is most interesting, they go on to speak of practical application of the legislation. I quote:
This means that a considerable number of companies established in Quebec will from now on be subject to the federal legislation rather than the Quebec legislation, and this is not likely to make it any easier for members of the public seeking to find out what their rights are in this context of changing legislation. As well, Quebec-based businesses will be required to master a new system for the protection of personal information, one which differs considerably from the one in place in Quebec.
Returning to the phrase “a considerable number of companies established in Quebec will from now on be subject to the federal legislation rather than the Quebec legislation”, this means that they were previously subject to the Quebec legislation. Does the hon. member realize that there was no legal vacuum, as she seems to be implying, that it is not like everyone was urging the federal government to get involved and set up different rules?
I now come to the recommendation made by the Quebec bar, which supports that of the access to information commission and which provides that:
To avoid any confusion and ensure that Quebecers can continue to benefit from a comprehensive personal information protection program, we submit that Bill C-54—now Bill C-6—should be amended to provide expressly that the federal legislation will not apply to businesses governed by the Privacy Act in the private sector.
I can already see the hon. member getting ready to say “Yes, but what about those for whom that act would not apply?” Her friends from the bar added:
“We go even further. In our opinion, the bill should incorporate by reference the Quebec legislation, even in areas of federal jurisdiction, to avoid confusion, overlap and duplication in the legislation applied in Quebec”.
It comes from the Quebec bar, which represents lawyers. These are experts who looked at this legislation and told us that it will create chaos and make things extremely complicated. To avoid that, they propose a simple solution. But this government will never recognize the primacy of the Quebec law, even if it concerns the civil code, which makes us so distinct in the eyes of the federal government.
When the federal government defines Quebec's distinctive character, it usually points to two or three elements. The government includes as few elements as possible, but it usually mentions the civil code. Yet, with this legislation, it is not even prepared to recognize the civil code.
So, what does the member have to say to the Barreau? Not to us on this side, to the members across the way to her right and to your left, Mr. Speaker. What does she have to say to the Barreau du Québec, which is suggesting this should be the solution?
And, before concluding, I would like to come back to one point. She says: “Yes, but we will not be able to regulate out-of-province companies doing business in Quebec”. If that logic applied, how is the Government of Canada going to be able to regulate an American company doing business in Canada?
Using her logic, it could not, because she is saying that Quebec's legislation does not apply to a company holding information obtained in Quebec, if the company is based outside Quebec. So what is she going to do about an American company that obtains information here and holds it in the United States? If the Government of Canada can do it, why would Quebec not be able to do it for Canada?
There is something a bit illogical about what she is saying and I would like her to explain to me why she thinks Quebec cannot fully legislate this situation when, if this were true, the same logic would apply to Canada, which would be able to legislate in respect of American companies.
I would like her to explain this and to respond to the brief from the Barreau that I have just cited and which is very specific. If she wishes, I can give her a copy of the document.