Mr. Speaker, I have read Bill C-209 with a great deal of care. I looked at it from the point of view of the times we are living in.
Hon. members will understand that a bill must be looked at in relation to current practices, where our society is at, what is tolerated and what is not. Bills are not initiated solely out of personal convictions, although having such convictions helps. Their purpose is not self-gratification. They are made to be implemented and properly implemented in society.
I asked myself whether, generally speaking, society had changed its opinion on the approach to be used with young people aged 14 or 16. It depends on what legislation we are looking at. The existing legislation sets the age at 14 years, while the one proposed by the hon. member sets it at 16.
I think society has evolved from where it was five, ten or fifteen years ago. The changes proposed are not in the direction of a change in society. On the contrary, they are a backward step, a regression in what is tolerated, and I wonder about the justification.
It is certainly not desirable for young people aged 14 or 15 to engage in sexual acts or to be in the presence of such acts. But when the legislator drafted these clauses, I imagine he was listening carefully to what the public wanted. The legislator paid careful attention to what the people in the various ridings were prepared to tolerate.
I cannot see how we could say today “What was true 10 or 15 years ago is no longer true, and the Criminal Code must be amended to increase the age from 14 to 16”.
What I find most surprising is that this is a bill to change age on the grounds that an adolescent 14 years of age cannot validly give consent, and the age must be increased to 16, and that it is a member of the Reform Party speaking, when in the debate on young offenders these same people said the age should be lowered to 14 or 15 because they are responsible.
There is something wrong with these two sorts of thinking. Either they are responsible or they are not. A person cannot be responsible for a delinquent act and not be responsible for an act of a sexual nature. A person is responsible in all matters, not just when it suits the Reform member.
I have two children, a 7-year old and a 10-year old. I know very well that today's children are much more mature than those of 30 years ago when I was their age. My children have much more mature discussions. They are much more aware of what is going on than were children of the same age 10 or 15 years ago.
I do not excuse people wanting to have sexual relations with someone aged 15. I cannot excuse it, but I think there are children 15 years of age who are sufficiently mature to give their consent.
It would be an infringement of certain rights not to allow a man or a woman—because we are talking about both sexes—to invoke the consent of his or her partner. This is precisely what Bill C-209 introduced by the member would do.
Now I have the attention of Reformers. This does not surprise me. Quebec and western Canada are worlds apart legally. I think you are great folks but we will never agree on how this country should be run. Let us go when we call the next referendum. Let us go and you can do what you want in your wonderful country and we will do what we want in the country of Quebec.
In the meantime, we are still in Canada and I still have a mandate from my constituents to say what I think and to express their views as well. In all honesty, my constituents will not be able to support such a bill once they know what it is all about. For those reasons, I cannot support this bill.