Madam Speaker, I am pleased to say a few words on Bill C-65.
I differ a bit from my friend who just spoke. At this second reading stage we will be supporting Bill C-65 but with a little qualification. I think it is fair to say that when we look at the formula for determining the equalization payments, it is appropriate that in committee we examine this in considerable detail. I think my hon. friend who just spoke pointed out the reason for that, that this is a complicated formula and if we are to pass this legislation beyond committee stage it is crucial that we examine that.
I want to use this as an opportunity to point out one other aspect, to simply note the various revenue sources that are identified: personal income taxes, corporate income taxes, taxes on capital corporations, general and miscellaneous sales taxes, harmonized sales taxes, amusement taxes, tobacco taxes, motor fuel taxes, non-commercial motor vehicle licence revenues, commercial motor vehicle licence revenues, alcoholic beverage revenues, hospital and medical care insurance premiums, forestry revenues, conventional new oil revenues, conventional old oil revenues, heavy oil revenues, mined oil revenues, light and medium third oil revenues, heavy third oil revenues, revenues from domestically sold natural gas, revenues from exported natural gas, sales of crown leases, sales of reservations on oil and natural gas lands, oil and natural gas revenues other than those just described, mining revenues, water power rentals, insurance premium taxes, payroll taxes, provincial local government property taxes, race track taxes, revenues from lottery ticket taxes, revenues from games of chance taxes, miscellaneous provincial taxes, provincial revenues from sales of goods and services, local government revenues from sales of goods and services, miscellaneous local government taxes and revenues.
I think I have made my point. A lot of taxes have been identified in this legislation. It seems to me that it would be appropriate for us to ask the question whether these individual taxes make sense. At the time they were introduced I think it is fair to say there was probably some rationale behind them. People thought they were appropriate social or economic policy taxes.
It is important now to identify each and every one of these tax exempt areas and factor in a cost benefit analysis. What is the cost to the taxpayer and what is the benefit? If it is not clear that there is a benefit then these taxes should be dropped. It is a recommendation that any fair-minded person would agree with.
Obviously I am not arguing against the principle of the bill. The whole principle of equalization and having a level playing field for Canadians no matter where they live in terms of access to social programs, education, health care opportunities and economic opportunities is absolutely crucial.
Canada is all about the Canadian family. It differentiates us from any other countries. Whether one lives in an isolated part of Canada, on the east coast, on the north coast, on the west coast or in central Canada, one will have relatively the same access to programs. That is what the country is all about. That is what a civilized country is all about. That is what Canada is all about. This program helps facilitate that whole idea.
Let us not be so arrogant that we think it cannot be improved. That is what we are saying. While the principle is fundamental to the Canadian ethic, it is imperative when the legislation reaches committee that we determine whether this is the most appropriate way.
I have heard my friend and others raise the point about the Premier of Newfoundland and how it would appear that there has been some monkeying around with this equalization bill in order for him to say he had a balanced budget just days before the election, which resulted in a more favourable election result. These are the abuses of the system that if in fact they were the case we have to find ways and means of mitigating them in the future.
In conclusion, on behalf of the New Democratic Party I say that we will support the bill enthusiastically at this stage of principle, but we have many serious questions that we want to ask in committee. We look forwarding to getting it into committee, although not quite in this much of a hurry. We are under time allocation which is, let us face it, an undemocratic use of the rules of the House of Commons.
I would not want to say we can hear jack boots echoing in the hallways just around the corner, but there is something fundamentally wrong when the government starts muzzling Canadian representatives, when it starts saying to the people of Canada that it does not want to hear the view from some part of the country because it has heard enough and wants to close the place down. It wants to muzzle parliament. It wants to bring to an end the democratic process. There is something fundamentally wrong about a government that decides it has heard enough.
I remember a little while back when the Conservatives were on that side and the Liberals were on this side. They would go into a state of absolute hysterics every time some form of time allocation or closure was brought in. They would stand and say this was an element of fascism, undemocratic and un-Canadian, that this was wrong, not right and ought not to occur. Lo and behold there is an election and they flip across to the other side and now they do the same thing more often.
When the Liberals said before the last election that if they became the government they would not act like the Conservatives did in the matter of muzzling parliament we thought they meant less time allocation. We thought they meant less use of closure. They meant more use of closure, more abuse of parliament.
We have to pay very close attention, as my friend said in his presentation, and listen closely to what they are saying. When they say they want to change parliament let us ask them if that means improve parliament or make it less democratic so as to make it perfectly clear in the future.
It is not with much enthusiasm that we now look forward to a vote at the end of the day, but the sooner the bill gets to committee and we find out some of the details, the better we will be able to change and amend the legislation.