Debates of March 18th, 1999

The Economy

[John Manley, Liberal, Minister of Industry]

Mr. Speaker, of course I was telling the truth in the speech I gave. I was saying exactly the point that the productivity challenge is a real one for Canadians to face.

In the simplistic world in which members of the Reform Party live the solutions are never complicated. They recognize that productivity is part of the solution, but if we promote a program to support research and development in the private sector they are prepared to ignore the fact that it is an important component of productivity. They vote against it. In fact, they do their best to undermine programs that support research and development in the private sector.

[Deborah Grey, Reform, Edmonton North, AB]

Mr. Speaker, now we have seen productivity challenged in the flesh. This is just unbelievable.

The date of that speech was February 18 and it was using recent statistics. The place was the Empire Club in Toronto. The topic was Canada's falling standard of living. If it demanded a speech, there must be something to it.

He said that we were poorer than states like Mississippi. He said that we were $7,000 poorer for each Canadian or $28,000 for a family of four. That is a chunk of change. Does he stand by his speech, or have the finance minister and the Prime Minister—

[The Speaker]

The hon. Minister of Industry.

[John Manley, Liberal, Minister of Industry]

Mr. Speaker, I stand by the speech and I deny categorically that it says anything of the sort. It is astonishing.

Certainly I compared productivity rates and productivity growth but everybody knows that only leads to standards of living in the future. Again last year, for the fifth time in a row, Canada topped the United Nations human development index. That is where we measure the quality of life in this country.

If the country does not address the issue of productivity, we will face problems with standard of living, but to this point we have met the real challenges that have been impeding our productivity growth for years.

Employment Insurance

[Gilles Duceppe, Bloc, Laurier—Sainte-Marie, QC]

Mr. Speaker, for three years now the Bloc Quebecois has been calling for employment insurance changes.

Once again this week the minister has thumbed his nose at the plight of the unemployed and, full of self-importance, has responded to our questions with “Your figures are wrong”.

Is the minister, who has had the real picture of his reform in his hands since 1998, prepared to eat humble pie, to acknowledge that the Bloc Quebecois was right, and to make changes in the Employment Insurance Act as soon as possible?

[Pierre Pettigrew, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development]

Mr. Speaker, as you know, we have brought in some very important changes with the employment insurance reform, a reform that was necessary.

We were aware that this reform would have an impact, in some cases a difficult one, on some Canadians. We included the requirement of annual reports within our reform in order to carry out a proper follow-up.

However, I would like to draw the attention of the leader of the Bloc Quebecois, who claims to never make mistakes with figures, to the fact that he has demonstrated the opposite today, showing that in many areas there were major holes in the statements made by the Bloc Quebecois, and today's report also demonstrates this.

[Gilles Duceppe, Bloc, Laurier—Sainte-Marie, QC]

Mr. Speaker, if the minister would be so kind as to crawl out of his hole and point out where our mistakes were, I invite him to do so.

He is still keeping his eyes shut, however. This minister continues to turn a blind eye to the sufferings of people, of families, of the poor, of youth, most particularly of young people and women. He has had the figures since December 1998 and has given us nothing but ridiculous answers ever since. He had the figures before the budget was brought down.

Why did he not stand up to the Minister of Finance? Why did he let him dip into the employment insurance fund? Why did he allow him to grab millions of dollars rather than change the legislation, which penalized young people and women?

[Pierre Pettigrew, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development]

Mr. Speaker, the suffering of the unemployed affects us as much on this side of the House as on the other. The opposition has no monopoly on compassion in this country of Canada.

I can assure the hon. member of one thing. We have the same compassion for the unemployed, which is precisely why we want to give them the dignity of employment: we want to help them into the work force, we have their good at heart and we do not simply want to take the easy way out and keep them on employment insurance, as the members opposite want to do.

[Paul Crête, Bloc, Kamouraska—Rivière-Du-Loup—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Mr. Speaker, exactly three years ago today, the predecessor of the current Minister of Human Resources Development, Doug Young, gave me the following answer on the subject of employment insurance, and I quote:

We believe that women and young people will benefit from this system. If we see that the results are not in keeping with the objectives of our program, we will obviously have to correct them.

Will Doug Young's successor, the current Minister of Human Resources Development, honour the word of his predecessor and correct the enormous failings of the employment insurance plan, which are hard on women and young people?

[Pierre Pettigrew, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development]

Mr. Speaker, some claim the young should be able to draw more employment insurance benefits. We think young Canadians must have the opportunity to get a good education and hold good jobs. That is what we are trying to do on this side of the House.

Most young Canadians share these values with us. In fact, 143,000 new jobs were created for young people in 1998, the best performance in 20 years. That is what young people expect from good government.

[Paul Crête, Bloc, Kamouraska—Rivière-Du-Loup—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Mr. Speaker, for three years now the unemployed have served as guinea pigs for this government.

Does the minister not think that this has gone on long enough, that the unemployed have done without long enough and that it is high time the minister rolled up his sleeve and set to work on improving the employment insurance plan, something the Bloc Quebecois has been demanding for the past three years?

[Pierre Pettigrew, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development]

Mr. Speaker, I repeat, the best way we can serve the unemployed is to give them real help to return to the labour market. And that is what we have done: 450,000 new jobs were created in the Canadian economy last year.

There are accordingly far fewer unemployed in Canada than there were. And if we followed the policy the Bloc Quebecois wants us to, we would simply go back to a system that served neither Canadians nor the unemployed.

[Alexa McDonough, NDP, Halifax, NS]

Mr. Speaker, the labour market is changing dramatically but the human resources development minister does not seem to understand the changes.

In the new economy more and more young people are working part time. In the new economy women are faced with fewer available hours or many are forced into self-employment, and yet these are the very people who are being penalized by the Liberals EI changes.

Why does the government think that attacking women and young people helps them to adapt to the new economy?

[Pierre Pettigrew, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development]

First of all, Mr. Speaker, part time workers were never insured by the employment insurance system. We should first look at the reality. They were not covered before.

What I can say is that indeed I am concerned about making sure that EI treats women in a fair and equitable way. It is very important. Why is it that fewer women have claimed EI in the last year? Is it because 300,000 more women are working in the labour market now, or is it because the system is squeezing them out of it? I am concerned and we will look into it.

[Alexa McDonough, NDP, Halifax, NS]

Mr. Speaker, the minister should read his report, which says that most of the results of the reform were anticipated. The government knew that its reform would hit women and young people harder.

Since the government knew, why did it implement changes that discriminated against women and young people?

[Pierre Pettigrew, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development]

Mr. Speaker, we definitely did not implement such measures.

Some would want us to give EI benefits to young people. I say that, on the contrary, young people want help to continue their education. They want a good education in order to find good jobs on the labour market.

As for women, we must sincerely be concerned about their situation. Is the number of women who claimed EI benefits primarily related to the fact that, in the past year, 300,000 jobs went to women? We have to ask ourselves that question.

Trade

[Rick Borotsik, Progressive Conservative, Brandon—Souris, MB]

Mr. Speaker, yesterday the WTO ruled against Canada and said that its export dairy pricing policy was illegal. Yesterday the Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food stood before reporters and said that this would not have any impact on our negotiations in the upcoming WTO trade talks.

In Washington recently we were told time and time again that supply managed systems and state trading enterprises were the number one issue that Americans were going to put on the table.

Can the minister honestly say that this ruling will not have any impact on our trade position?

[Lyle Vanclief, Liberal, Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food]

Mr. Speaker, the ruling yesterday does not have any impact on the domestic supply management system in Canada. That was not what was before the panel as a challenge by the United States and New Zealand. They did question some of the administration of some of the export of Canadian milk products out of Canada amounting to less than 5% of the milk production in Canada.

We are reviewing the report with all of the partners. We will be deciding on a response to that panel decision next week.

[Rick Borotsik, Progressive Conservative, Brandon—Souris, MB]

Mr. Speaker, if the minister does not take the ruling very seriously, perhaps he should take seriously the comments made recently by the chairman of the U.S. federal reserve, Alan Greenspan. He said this week that Canada and Australia were to blame for the farm commodity crisis in the U.S. We all know that when Mr. Greenspan speaks, America listens. Unfortunately the Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food and the Minister for International Trade are not listening.

What is the Canadian government going to do to respond to Alan Greenspan and the American producers?

[Lyle Vanclief, Liberal, Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food]

Mr. Speaker, we are going to respond to Mr. Greenspan and to the realities in the agriculture market today by abiding by the international trading agreements to which we are signatories. I am very surprised that the hon. member is not standing up and supporting supply management rather than being a scaremonger.

The Economy

[Gerry Ritz, Reform, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

Mr. Speaker, in a speech the industry minister has quickly forgotten, and it was only one month ago in Toronto, he talked about productivity in Canada and if it had grown 1.2% faster we would not have the $7,000 gap we now have with the Americans leading to a $7,000 per year per person shortfall in this country. Is he denying that he actually said that?

[John Manley, Liberal, Minister of Industry]

No, Mr. Speaker. In fact that is exactly what I said. Had productivity grown 1.2% per year faster over 25 years, then the GDP per capita would be $7,000 higher. But that is simple. Productivity leads to economic growth. That in turn relates to output. Output per capita would be higher if we produced more. That is not complicated.

What is complicated is to determine what the factors are that contribute to productivity growth and how can we improve Canada's standing relative to other countries. That is what I was talking about.

[Gerry Ritz, Reform, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

Mr. Speaker, all through that speech he did talk about a productivity growth challenge here in Canada. I guess he has to realize that high taxes and high debt kill any kind of productivity that Canadians care to put forward.

Has the industry minister changed his stance now that the PMO writes his speeches?

[John Manley, Liberal, Minister of Industry]

Mr. Speaker, I would be delighted to find someone else to write speeches for me, I can assure you.

Sometimes I think that H. L. Mencken had the Reform Party in mind when he said years ago before they had even thought of it that for every problem there is a simple neat solution that is wrong.

Official Languages

[Monique Guay, Bloc, Laurentides, QC]

Mr. Speaker, today the Minister of Canadian Heritage launched the Year of the Francophonie in Canada.

Considering that the minister spent the week telling us that the federal government was doing a great job looking after the interests of francophones outside Quebec, how does she explain that a journalist from Radio-Canada, in Moncton, could only get a press kit in English?