You are right, Madam Speaker, it is a point for debate and it is a wrong debate, a wrong position.
The cornerstone has three prongs we are advocating which are having a loan guarantee program, bilateral trade with the Americans and tax reduction. I know Reformers are not real Conservatives by any means. They do not understand what tax reduction is in that regard.
To my colleagues in the Liberal Party of Canada, I know that they categorically want to help individuals. We are not asking them to spend any amount of money, but I have to remind the hon. member who spoke on behalf of the Liberal government that its own members from Atlantic Canada are advocating the need to improve its shipbuilding policy that is incentive based, not subsidy driven, so that we can get those men and women back to work.
Above all, perhaps the thing I am most shocked about is the very fact that every single time we have had a shipbuilding motion before the House they have never permitted on any occasion any member from the Liberal caucus who has a seat in Atlantic Canada to actually participate in the debate. I wonder why that is. Is it because the Minister of Industry is blocking it?
I know that the member from Moncton, the Minister of Labour, really wants to advance this particular debate. In order to do so I would hope that she participates in the debate tomorrow. We are going to be debating shipbuilding again with respect to the private members' motion by the hon. member from Lévis. What we are doing today from a shipbuilding perspective is not working. We have an unprecedented coalition of individuals who are looking for tax reduction, not subsidies, to modernize the shipbuilding industry.
We have had Reform members flip flop. This is nothing new for them. Two or three Reform members came to committee to say they support what we were doing. Then they came to the House and said that they did not support it. They cannot make up their minds. Maybe in tomorrow's debate we will get a new Reform speech and have a new perspective in that regard.