Debates of April 5th, 2000

Transport

[David Collenette, Liberal, Minister of Transport]

Mr. Speaker, Marine Atlantic is determined to negotiate the best deal possible for the Government of Canada to get a new ferry fast on the gulf service.

That is the priority and we have every confidence in the chairman, Captain Sid Hynes, of the Marine Atlantic board, who knows the shipping industry, to get the best deal so that we can get the ferry up and running.

It seems to me that the Conservative Party is more intent on making political points than getting passengers served this summer on the gulf.

[Norman E. Doyle, Progressive Conservative, St. John's East, NL]

By George, I smell a rat here, Mr. Speaker.

We have information that if the identity of the broker on this transaction were known there would be an immediate perception of a conflict of interest. Will the minister tell us who the broker is? Will he assure us that there is no conflict of interest, either on the part of a person or persons in Marine Atlantic, or on the part of any member of the government?

[David Collenette, Liberal, Minister of Transport]

Mr. Speaker, we are absolutely satisfied that all of the normal procedures have been followed.

The hon. member says that he can smell a rat. Perhaps he is talking about rats leaving a sinking ship, the caucus members from the Tory party abandoning that party.

Canada Development Corporation

[Chuck Strahl, Reform, Fraser Valley, BC]

Mr. Speaker, in May 1999 we submitted an access to information request asking for minutes from CDC that would show if the minister were involved in the tainted blood scandal.

A memo on July 6 showed that these minutes had been faxed from the ethics counsellor to the Department of Finance. Let me quote from that memo. It says:

We did fax a copy of the CDC minutes we received from Nova Corporation. She should work on the basis that it is publicly known we faxed the minutes to them.

In other words, the ethics counsellor warned the finance department that it had these potentially explosive documents in its possession. Why did the minister not release these documents to the opposition and to the public?

[Paul Martin, Liberal, Minister of Finance]

Mr. Speaker, the CDC was a government owned corporation. It was a corporation as well that was involved with the Department of Finance, the Department of Industry and a number of government departments throughout the eighties, long before this government took office.

Because the company involved was a subsidiary of a subsidiary of the CDC, companies which had been sold, in order to find those minutes an exhaustive investigation was required, which I believe is still ongoing but I believe now very close to completion.

The Department of Finance was one of the departments that was involved but it was all handled by public servants.

[Chuck Strahl, Reform, Fraser Valley, BC]

Mr. Speaker, the rest of the relationship between the finance minister and these corporations will be explored later on. Right now what we are talking about is the finance minister's own department.

On July 8, two days after the ethics counsellor had warned the finance department that it had those documents in its possession, the very same finance department wrote back to us and said the following:

I must inform you that after a thorough search no records were found to respond to either of your requests.

Why did the finance department deny that it was in possession of these crucial documents when these documents were sitting on the finance department's desk?

[Paul Martin, Liberal, Minister of Finance]

Mr. Speaker, for obvious reasons as the ethics counsellor continued his investigation into this matter I was not informed and was not kept up to date.

Therefore, I really cannot answer the question except to say to the hon. member the documentation that was largely existing in the finance department was not of a kind that would convey any such information. That is why the investigation had to go beyond the finance department into a whole series of other government departments and agencies.

Human Resources Development

[Paul Crête, Bloc, Kamouraska—Rivière-Du-Loup—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Mr. Speaker, we have asked a considerable number of questions about Placeteco. The President of Treasury Board even gave some thought to placing Human Resources Development Canada under trusteeship. However, she finally decided, no doubt so as to spare her colleague at HRDC further embarrassment, just to send over one of her employees to provide some monitoring of the situation.

Can the President of Treasury Board tell us whether that person has looked into the Placeteco case and made a report to her on it?

[Lucienne Robillard, Liberal, President of the Treasury Board and Minister responsible for Infrastructure]

Mr. Speaker, I would point out to begin with, if I may, that the hon. member's introductory remarks are incorrect.

Treasury Board has available to it a series of tools for controlling this government's expenditures, including providing opinions and advice to departments and providing them with experts. It can even go so far as to withdraw delegation of authority.

Before selecting the appropriate tool, however, we assess not only the scope and origin of the problem but also, and above all, the department's ability to deal with it. The Department of Human Resources Development was fully capable of dealing with the present problem.

[Paul Crête, Bloc, Kamouraska—Rivière-Du-Loup—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Mr. Speaker, even the President of Treasury Board is refusing to answer our questions on Placeteco.

At any rate, as the Minister of Indian Affairs suggested yesterday in connection with another matter, I have written to the solicitor general asking for an investigation into the Placeteco matter. Can the solicitor general give me the assurance that he will follow up on my letter and take the appropriate steps to launch an investigation into Placeteco in order to finally bring the facts out in the open?

[Lawrence MacAulay, Liberal, Solicitor General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, what I can do is to indicate to my hon. colleague that I will read the letter and respond to him.

Canada Development Corporation

[Jay Hill, Reform, Prince George—Peace River, BC]

Mr. Speaker, the issue of the finance minister having found himself in a potential conflict of interest due to his past directorship with the Canada Development Corporation is hardly new.

On May 25, 1999, when questioned in the House he replied, and I quote from Hansard :

I would be delighted to have whatever papers could be made available to be made available.

We now know that his department had copies of CDC minutes by July 8 yet replied to our request that it did not. Why did the Minister of Finance not keep his word to the House?

[Paul Martin, Liberal, Minister of Finance]

Mr. Speaker, it is my understanding, and I would ask the hon. member to verify this with the ethics counsellor, that the ethics counsellor will make all documentation available when he makes his report.

[Jay Hill, Reform, Prince George—Peace River, BC]

Mr. Speaker, we are talking about documentation sent by the minister's own department. Reading once again from Hansard , May 25, 1999, at page 15255, the Minister of Finance stated:

I have asked my officials to look at our papers but at the present time we have found nothing.

We know the Department of Finance had a faxed copy of the CDC minutes by July 6 yet on July 8 advised that it did not possess these documents.

Six weeks after the finance minister said they had found nothing, they still said they had found nothing. Did they conveniently lose the documents, or did they fail to obey the finance minister's instructions?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, it is absolutely ludicrous what they are doing. Here is a problem dating from years before we formed the government, when the Minister of Finance was serving on a board where he had no shares. It is related to a subsidiary of a subsidiary. He himself asked me to ask the ethics counsellor to look into it and he is doing that at this time.

They want to stir up something based on nothing. Let us wait for the report. The report will be made public. I have discussed this with the Minister of Finance and he has absolutely no conflict of interest.

Fisheries

[Yvan Bernier, Bloc, Bonaventure—Gaspé—Îles-De-La-Madeleine—Pabok, QC]

Mr. Speaker, there is concern that the fishers in Quebec are paying for the agreements the federal government is about to sign with the first nations of the maritimes, and the minister's responses in the House have provided no reassurance.

Could the Minister of Fisheries and Oceans reassure the fishers in the Gaspé by confirming for them unequivocally that the licenses to be bought back from Quebec fishers will be given to native fishers in Quebec and not in other provinces?

[Herb Dhaliwal, Liberal, Minister of Fisheries and Oceans]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member has all his facts totally wrong. He should do his research and then he would get to the facts.

It is very interesting that we have heard in the House from opposition members about the social problems with our aboriginal communities on the reserves, but when it comes to solutions they do not want to be a part of the solution. They want someone else to be part of the solution.

Do they really care about aboriginal people? Are they really interested in helping them? From the questions I hear, I do not think so.

[Yvan Bernier, Bloc, Bonaventure—Gaspé—Îles-De-La-Madeleine—Pabok, QC]

Mr. Speaker, once again the remarks of the minister provide no assurance, but I would first have him understand that he must consider the human factor in the impact of his decisions.

My question is very simple question: will he commit to ensuring that Quebec fishing quotas remain with Quebec residents and protect the fish plant jobs in Quebec?

[Herb Dhaliwal, Liberal, Minister of Fisheries and Oceans]

Mr. Speaker, that is the parochial view of this member and his party. They want to make sure that no one else can benefit.

To ease the hon. member's concerns, I can assure him that the quota acquired in Quebec will go to Quebec bands. Is he against that? If he is, he should stand and tell us.

Canada Development Corporation

[Bob Mills, Reform, Red Deer, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Finance has denied that CDC was connected directly to Connaught. In fact, on February 5, 1985, when the Minister of Finance was on the board of directors of CDC, CDC cut a $4 million cheque for a blood fractionation plant for Connaught Labs.

When the board of directors authorizes a $4 million cheque it is pretty hard to believe that someone on the board would not know what it was for. How can the minister deny that he did not know what Connaught Labs was doing with the $4 million?

[Paul Martin, Liberal, Minister of Finance]

Mr. Speaker, Connaught was a subsidiary of a subsidiary of the CDC. Also there were joint ventures involved.

If the hon. member had sat on boards he would understand that it is quite conceivable that kind of thing might or might not have come about. The fact is that the whole matter has been referred to the ethics counsellor who has conducted a thorough investigation. We are all looking forward to his report.

[Bob Mills, Reform, Red Deer, AB]

Mr. Speaker, it is close to a year ago that the ethics counsellor was doing this report. How long do we have to wait for a report and how incriminating is that report?

It is hard to believe that someone on the board of directors of a business would authorize a $4 million cheque and not know what it was for. I do not care what kind of business it is.

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Finance and I have been very clear that there will be a report. Now they are complaining because the ethics counsellor is doing a thorough job, analyzing everything and going into all the companies.

The Minister of Finance could not have had any interest in that company because it was a crown corporation. He had perhaps one or two shares or a few shares to qualify to be a director, but all the shares belonged to all the citizens of Canada at that time. He obviously did not have a personal conflict of interest.

Parental Leave

[Christiane Gagnon, Bloc, Québec, QC]

Mr. Speaker, Quebec has developed a parental leave policy that is better suited to the new realities of the labour market that the federal government's policy.

The minister sees herself as being very generous with her doubled parental leave, but does she not realize that by stubbornly refusing to reduce the eligibility threshold to 300 hours, increase coverage to 70%, eliminate the waiting period and include self-employed women, she will continue to impoverish thousands of women by denying them access to parental leave?

[Jane Stewart, Liberal, Minister of Human Resources Development]

Mr. Speaker, let us look at what we have done. First and foremost, we have doubled the parental benefit to a year. Parents can be home for a year.

We have reduced the number of hours required to get special benefits from 700 hours to 600 hours. We have tripled the amount of time that adoptive parents will be home with their children. We have taken away the second waiting period required. Then perhaps the dad can be home with the child.

We are making it very clear to Canadians that we understand the challenges between workplace and family. We are doing something about it for all Canadians.