House of Commons Hansard #18 of the 37th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was federal.
John McKay Liberal Scarborough East, ON
Madam Speaker, I rise on a point of order. Before my hon. colleague speaks, I note that there are still a number of members who still want to speak in this important debate. Pursuant to Standing Order 26(1), I move that the House continue to sit beyond the ordinary hour of daily adjournment to consider Government Business No. 4.
Health Care SystemGovernment Orders
The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bakopanos)
I will refer the hon. member to page 345 of Marleau and Montpetit which states:
Such a motion can be moved by any Member in the course of debate but not on a point of order--
John McKay Liberal Scarborough East, ON
Madam Speaker, if I am not moving on a point of order then I am in the middle of the debate, am I not?
Health Care SystemGovernment Orders
The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bakopanos)
No. The hon. member would or another member would have to have the floor during the course of the debate to move such a motion.
Questions and comments, the hon. member for Esquimalt--Juan de Fuca.
Keith Martin Canadian Alliance Esquimalt—Juan de Fuca, BC
Madam Speaker, I want to thank my friend from Prince George for his comments. His constituents ought to know of the very hard work he has done in trying to get physicians and other medical personnel in Prince George and at the place where I work.
Prince George is the major trauma centre for the northern half of British Columbia. I have been working there on and off since 1988. There have been periods, for example over Christmas, where for three or four days in a major trauma centre we did not have any orthopedic coverage for 200,000 people. In fact half of the specialist coverage was not there. We simply did not have it at that time. That is still a problem.
I want my friend to describe the situation he finds not only in Prince George but in his rural riding of northern B.C. because it affects rural ridings across the country. Perhaps he could comment on the lack of basic health care resources for his constituents and how to ensure that they have the proper care they desperately require. Perhaps he could comment on the pain and suffering they endure because of the lack of resources in the hospital and in his community at this point in time.
Jay Hill Canadian Alliance Prince George—Peace River, BC
Madam Speaker, to expand on what I said previously, one of the things in which I, personally, and my staff have been involved, right back to the first time I was elected in 1993, has been interacting with the local medical clinics in the towns and cities in my riding. They are considerable. I know other members do as well.
We try to alleviate some of the doctor shortages by assisting foreign doctors, primarily doctors from South Africa, to come to Canada. We help them to get through the myriad of problems with immigration and work visas so they can have a locum and can give Canadian doctors a break, in some cases the first break they have had for years, or give other professionals the opportunity to upgrade their skills, which they often do not have adequate time to do.
It is so serious that I cannot emphasize too much what we in Prince George—Peace River and, I believe, to a very large extent, in rural Canada, are up against. The rubber is meeting the road.
We are having this take note debate and I believe it is worthwhile. It allows members the opportunity to stand and present cases of how it is affecting their constituents and, in some cases, their very own families. I certainly have had experiences with my family. My father is on a waiting list for an operation back home and is in considerable pain. I know other members have similar experiences. It is tragic that we are still talking about health care instead of doing something about it.
One of the things we have to look at and that the government seems unwilling to look at is increasing the flexibility that the provinces have to be innovative. It is one of the primary planks of our platform on health care reform. I do not see it coming from the government. I do not see it, to a large extent, coming from Kirby and I doubt that we will see it from Romanow.
John McKay Liberal Scarborough East, ON
Madam Speaker, I listened to the hon. member's speech and I know he is concerned about the amounts of money that flow from the federal government to the provincial government. I wonder if he could enlighten the House as to the amount of direct transfers that the federal government gives to the government of British Columbia both in cash and in tax points, and the direct spending on health care in his province. I think it would enlighten the debate.
On that point, I note that there is still quite an interest on both sides of the House in the debate. I wonder whether we might consider extending the hour pursuant to Standing Order 26(2).
Health Care SystemGovernment Orders
The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bakopanos)
The hon. member would have to ask for the unanimous consent of the House to extend the time. Would you like to put the motion?
John McKay Liberal Scarborough East, ON
Madam Speaker, I am making reference to Standing Order 26(2). It states:
In putting the question on such motion, the Speaker shall ask those Members who object to rise in their places. If fifteen or more Members then rise, the motion shall be deemed to have been withdrawn;--
Jay Hill Canadian Alliance Prince George—Peace River, BC
Madam Speaker, I rise on the same point. With all due respect, I think this has already been ruled on, and quite rightly so. When the hon. member is not involved in debate, in other words he or his party does not have a speaking slot, which they gave up a while ago, he should have moved the motion at that time or had one of his colleagues do it.
Health Care SystemGovernment Orders
The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bakopanos)
I thank the hon. member for his guidance but I will repeat what I said earlier in case it was not clear.
On page 345 of Montpetit and Marleau it states:
Such a motion can be moved by any Member in the course of debate but not on a point of order, nor during the period reserved for questions and comments following a Member's speech,--
I think Montpetit and Marleau is very clear.
The hon. member has the option of course, because I am the servant of the House and not its master, to ask for unanimous consent.
Health Care SystemGovernment Orders
The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bakopanos)
Is there consent to extend the hours?
Keith Martin Canadian Alliance Esquimalt—Juan de Fuca, BC
Madam Speaker, the crux of the matter is that when we are looking at saving our publicly funded health care system it boils down to resources.
The fact is that we have a situation where the numbers of people who are working are constricting. Right now four people work for every retiree. In the next 20 years two people will be working for every retiree. That, in and of itself, will put unsustainable demands on our health care system. No matter what we do in terms of rationalizing our resources, which we have to do, the bottom line is that we have to find money somewhere.
Raising taxes, we would argue, is not an option because it has a depressing effect on our economy and will restrict the amount of money coming back into our system for social programs like health care.
Where do we find the money? Our only other option is in the private sector. I would argue that allowing parallel private services would take the demand out of the public system without removing resources. If we do that we would have a sustainable public health care system in the future.
As my colleague beside me said, why do we not turn the table on the Americans? Why not have American patients come to our private system so they will pay money into our system which would then go to support our public system?
Health Care SystemGovernment Orders
The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bakopanos)
It being 6.30 p.m., the House stands adjourned until tomorrow at 10 a.m., pursuant to Standing Order 24(1).
(The House adjourned at 6.30 p.m.)