Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order. Yesterday in the other place a point of order was raised regarding the Kyoto motion that I believe must be raised in this House as well.
As you are aware, Mr. Speaker, the motion in the Senate is identical to the motion before the House. While the Speaker in the Senate has reserved his decision, I do not think that should be a deterrent to raising it at this time, since the Senate Speaker's ruling, while we would of course consider it, is not binding on the House and in the past conflicting rulings on an identical matter have been brought down. Bill S-13 from the last Parliament comes to mind. The Senate Speaker ruled that it did not infringe on the financial privileges of the Commons and the Commons Speaker ruled that it did.
In any event, I hope the Senate Speaker rules before Françoise Ducros gets appointed there and becomes the Senate's next Speaker.
As you know, Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister appoints the Senate Speaker, another reason why we should be raising the matter here with our duly secret-ballot elected Speaker.
Having said that, I will go over the points made in the Senate and add a few more to those arguments.
Points were made regarding statements in the press that Parliament would ratify the Kyoto protocol and the statements were attributed to statements made by the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister gave the impression that Parliament would ratify Kyoto, and the motion that we ended up with calls on the government to ratify.
Although this adds to the confusion over the issue, what is more important is that Senator Cools and Senator Kinsella argued that the government motion calling on the government to ratify the Kyoto protocol could not be considered a government motion. They argued that a motion that calls on the Senate to recommend something to the government could hardly be considered a government motion.
In our case, the motion calls on the House to recommend something to the government. That is the job of private members during private members' business and it is the job of opposition parties on supply days.
I would like to point out to the government that if it thinks that by passing a motion calling on itself to do something it will get action, I advise the government to check its own record in these matters. The government should know that it does not listen. The last NDP supply day is a perfect example. Our supply motion dealing with the conditions that must be met before Kyoto is ratified is another example. The government ignored those motions and many others like them.
Or maybe the government will comply only with motions that call on itself to act. The government does not mind telling itself what to do; the government just does not like it when others tell it what to do. I have some news for the government: the House speaks with one voice, and when it adopts a resolution the respect given to the motion should be the same no matter who sponsors the motion. Motions should not be judged by the colour of the sponsor's party banner but by the content of the motion adopted by the House.
Yesterday, Mr. Speaker, you made a ruling in regard to the motion in the name of the right hon. member from Calgary. He had placed a motion on the Order Paper instructing a committee, asking it to determine the level of provincial support for Kyoto. The motion was listed to be moved under the rubric “Motions”. I suspect it was there because the member asked that it be placed there. However, Mr. Speaker, you ruled that it should properly be placed on the Order Paper as a private member's motion. As a result, its designation was changed and it was moved.
It is very important to get these things right, Mr. Speaker, because as you know there are different rules for different motions. The case of the motion from the right hon. gentleman is a good example. If the member's motion would have been allowed to be placed under “Motions”, it could have been moved as early as today at routine proceedings. Now that it is a private member's motion, the member will have to wait until his name is drawn in a lottery, and by the time that takes place Kyoto will have destroyed our economy.
This illustrates that the Speaker can decide these matters and it also illustrates what a difference a designation makes with respect to a motion.
One of the points made in the Senate was in regard to the Senate's rule of closure. The same argument can be made in the House. It is not a surprise that the Canadian Alliance will do whatever it can to prevent any ratification of the Kyoto protocol. With the government's record of using 80 closure motions, it is no surprise that it might use closure. In any event, the motion is eligible for closure and any motion that is closure worthy will be too irresistible for the government House leader to pass on his favourite pastime of moving closure.
Senator Kinsella pointed out the absurdity of the government asking the House to ask itself and then forcing the issue through closure of the government asking the House to ask itself. It is kind of a schizophrenic situation.
The government has many prerogatives that private members do not. It controls most of the business of the House. It can move certain motions and bills that private members cannot, like bills requiring royal recommendations. It can raise taxes through ways and means motions and it decides how the money is spent. Does it really need to be muscling in on private members' turf?
Does it need to beg itself to do something? While it is not always dignified, it is the role of private members and the opposition to beg the government. Maybe the Liberals see the writing on the wall and are already in opposition mode, calling on the government to take action. Maybe they have some internal polls they are not sharing with us.
Under the circumstances, I am tempted to recommend that this motion be moved to private members' business or be considered as a supply motion, but since it is sponsored by a cabinet minister it is disqualified. It is disqualified as a private member's motion, a supply motion and a government motion. To complete the set, I would argue that it cannot be moved as a motion under routine proceedings either because, as you have pointed out many times, Mr. Speaker, very few opportunities exist for private members' motions or motions of a private member's nature to be moved under the rubric “Motions”.
The fate of the motion, Government Business No. 9, should be that it be removed altogether from the Order Paper.
Mr. Speaker, I would also ask again for your considered opinion. Until you have given us a decision on this point of order and the other point of order, I would recommend for your consideration the actions of the Speaker in the other place, whereby he set aside the motion until he could come back with a decision as to the efficacy of moving forward with the motion at this time.