Debates of May 6th, 2002

The Economy

[The Speaker]

Order. I know that we have a popular minister and a popular member of the opposition rising but we do have to hear the question now.

The hon. member for Langley--Abbotsford has a question.

Grants and Contributions

[Randy White, Canadian Alliance, Langley—Abbotsford, BC]

Mr. Speaker, boy are they happy over there now.

This is not just about Wednesday's report of the Groupaction deal which just happened to donate $70,000 to the Liberal Party. We warned the government time and time again that its arrogance would overshadow its fiscal responsibility.

Now that the auditor general will indicate there should be an RCMP probe, I wonder, does the government understand it has a problem with corruption, with mismanagement and in fact with integrity itself?

[Don Boudria, Liberal, Minister of Public Works and Government Services]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member is giving summary justice. The report has not yet been tabled. The report will be tabled and will be answered appropriately, and the necessary actions will be taken. Making these gratuitous kinds of insinuations I do not believe helps.

[Randy White, Canadian Alliance, Langley—Abbotsford, BC]

Mr. Speaker, it must be a mistake that it only gave $70,000 to the Liberal Party. That is just a coincidence I guess.

Public works has been a feast of failure in the country for years. The deputy minister shovels pork into his hometown so he gives a profile to Ottawa or perhaps himself. The RCMP probes into Groupaction for something that should have never occurred in the first place. Alfonso Gagliano gets the pork posting of his life ahead of a probe. I wonder if the Prime Minister understands the words corruption, integrity--

[The Speaker]

The right hon. Prime Minister.

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I understand that very much, which is why in the nine years that we have formed the government not one person, not one member of parliament and not one minister has been accused of corruption in front of any court.

They keep using that word. They know that it is part of the criminal code. It was never used because we have offered a very good government. The answer that the Minister of Finance gave a minute ago proves that the international community has a lot of confidence in the administration of this government.

Airline Industry

[Diane Bourgeois, Bloc, Terrebonne—Blainville, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the board of directors of the Aéroports de Montréal is about to announce the transfer of passenger flights from Mirabel to Dorval as early as April 2003.

This flies in the face of common sense and violates the lease, which clearly stipulates that the lessee must use the premises for the purposes of a major international airport.

Given that the board of directors is making a complete mess of this and is not respecting the lease it signed, what is the Minister of Transport waiting for to ask for their resignations?

[André Harvey, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Transport]

Mr. Speaker, as usual, the Bloc Quebecois has not stopped to listen first. The two airports are run by a non-profit organization. No public report has yet been tabled. There has been no business plan. There is nothing to go on, and already they are accusing the board of incompetence. This is standard practice with the Bloc Quebecois.

Agriculture

[Paul Steckle, Liberal, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Mr. Speaker, rural Canada is the foundation upon which Canada was built. Furthermore, aside from being home to thousands, rural Canada supports the agriculture sector which is the second largest industry in the nation. With this in mind, could the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food tell the House what the government is doing to help rural Canada seize the opportunities that are desperately needed to keep this essential part of our economy alive?

[Larry McCormick, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food]

Mr. Speaker, the Government of Canada supports the agriculture and agrifood industry in rural communities in many ways.

One clear example of this support is the Canadian adaptation and rural development fund, also known as the CARD fund. Since it was created in 1995, CARD has provided more than $450 million in funding to thousands of projects nationally and regionally, and CARD has become a catalyst for turning dreams of creativity and innovation into reality in rural Canada.

This evening I invite all members of the House to the Chateau Laurier so they can see the CARD showcase and see how their funds are invested. Also, they will have an opportunity to meet many of the great agricultural leaders in this country.

Aboriginal Affairs

[Brian Pallister, Canadian Alliance, Portage—Lisgar, MB]

Mr. Speaker, the government says that it is consulting on aboriginal governance so let us see how it is doing in Manitoba.

In Manitoba we have 103,000 aboriginal people. How many participate in the consultation process? Fifty-three participate, and the numbers are lower in many other areas of the country.

The Liberals' guide for managers on aboriginal issues says, of proper consultation, “If an interested party is overlooked, the entire exercise could be frustrated.”

How can the Prime Minister claim that these consultations are any more legitimate than his 1969 ideas when he is violating his own government's guidelines on consultation?

[Stephen Owen, Liberal, Secretary of State (Western Economic Diversification) (Indian Affairs and Northern Development)]

Mr. Speaker, the government has taken part in extensive consultations across the country touching more than 10,000 members of first nations communities. We held 450 events in more than 200 first nations communities to get adequate consultation on this issue.

In addition, we are bringing forth legislation on governance and first nations institutions in the near future, and that will provide further opportunity for consultation through the House, through committee and across the country.

United Nations Special Session on Children

[Francine Lalonde, Bloc, Mercier, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister of Canada has decided not to take part in the United Nations' special session on children.

Is this not a perfect illustration of the embarrassment the Prime Minister feels, considering the dismal national figures since he took office, particularly the increase of almost 362,000 in the numbers of children living in poverty?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I had agreed to attend this UN session last fall. Unfortunately, because of the events of September 11, the session was cancelled and rescheduled. Since the meeting between Canada and the European Economic Community is taking place during the same week, Canada will be represented by the Deputy Prime Minister.

I regret not being able to attend, but we have been among the most active participants in the preparation of this session. I am taking this opportunity to thank the members of parliament, ministers and senators who took a special interest in this session. Many of them will be in New York City, on Thursday, to attend this event.

Petitions

[Peter MacKay, Progressive Conservative, Pictou—Antigonish—Guysborough, NS]

Mr. Speaker, pursuant to Standing Order 36 I have the pleasure to present a petition from the people of Canso and surrounding areas. The petitioners call on the government to take action, specifically the minister of fisheries whose denial of quota to the town of Canso has resulted in the closure of its plant.

The people of Canso are left without a livelihood. They are looking for a way to once again be contributors to their local economy and the national economy. They are calling on parliament and the minister to reconsider his decision or at the very least to come and meet with the people of Canso to discuss ways in which they can restore economic vigour.

Instead of focusing on patronage and rewarding friends the petitioners would like the government to revisit the resource centre economy in which they have been participants for almost 400 years. They call on the government to do something.

On behalf of the people of Canso and surrounding areas I am pleased to table this petition in their name. I hope the minister of fisheries will take it seriously as do the people of Canso, the mayor, the trawlermen's association, the people affected by schools and hospitals at risk of closing, and others in the town who are struggling.

On a day in which the subject matter of debate in parliament is centering on rural Canada it is time for the government to act with respect to the problems of people trying to make a living and earn respect in places like Canso, Nova Scotia in Guysborough County.

[Roy H. Bailey, Canadian Alliance, Souris—Moose Mountain, SK]

Mr. Speaker, I have petitions from all four western provinces. The petitioners are calling on the government to ensure the protection of our children from all sexual abusers.

They are asking that parliament pass legislation that would incarcerate indefinitely those offenders designated dangerous sexual child offenders and child rapists who have committed more than one offence against a child.

I am pleased to present this petition at this time.

Questions on the Order Paper

[Geoff Regan, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, I would ask that all questions be allowed to stand.

[The Speaker]

Is that agreed?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

The House resumed consideration of the motion.

Supply

[Peter MacKay, Progressive Conservative, Pictou—Antigonish—Guysborough, NS]

Mr. Speaker, before the question period recess into rhetoric and retreat there was a question from the hon. member for Prince George--Buckley Valley. He asked if I could enlighten him. That is probably more than anyone in the House could do, myself included.

He wanted to know why the government would choose to send corrupt and disgraced cabinet ministers abroad. He made reference to the fact that the Prime Minister likes to boast about never having had a cabinet minister resign while in office and never having had to fire one. It is quite simply because he has lowered the bar so much one could not limbo under it.

The Prime Minister has completely done away with the principle of parliamentary responsibility, the Westminster principle that cabinet ministers take responsibility for their actions and actions that occur within their departments. That is why cabinet ministers do not resign. That is why they get dispatched to places like Denmark as a big reward in the midst of turmoil, allegations and possible RCMP investigations.

The hon. member made another reference. He talked about corruption in previous governments. I would remind him he need only look in the mirror when talking about monumental reversals of position. I remind him in particular of some of the positions his party took with respect to Stornoway, pensions, political perks and doing things differently. His party made a spectacle of bringing to parliament a new way of doing things. Its members danced outside the Senate with Mexican hats on, waved Canadian flags around and had wetsuit press conferences.

The Liberals love it when the hon. member resorts to the tactic of throwing mud at a government of 10 years ago. It plays right into their hands. However there are no lessons to be learned from the Progressive Conservative Party on reversing oneself. Thank goodness the hon. member and his party will never get into power. If they reverse themselves on these positions while in opposition let us think what they would do if they ever got a sniff of power.

[Dick Harris, Canadian Alliance, Prince George—Bulkley Valley, BC]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member for Pictou--Antigonish--Guysborough did not answer the question regarding Alfonso Gagliano and whether he is allowed to be prosecuted, probed or charged under diplomatic immunity. The hon. member from Nova Scotia chose instead to personally attack me and my integrity.

He wonders why I have no time for the remnants of the Tory Party in terms of getting together in some sort of Alliance. It is because of insults and personal attacks like this which go on all the time, particularly from the more mouthy members like the hon. member for Pictou--Antigonish--Guysborough.

[Gerald Keddy, Progressive Conservative, South Shore, NS]

Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order.

If I heard what I think I heard it would be highly unparliamentary. We all say things in the House we should not. In the heat of the moment we allow ourselves to get carried away. However a certain degree of decorum is expected, and I would expect the last of those remarks was unparliamentary or out of order.

[The Speaker]

Perhaps the hon. member could specify which words he feels were out of order. The Chair recognizes that the debate is perhaps a little less than totally friendly at the moment, but we will hear from the hon. member for Pictou-Antigonish--Guysborough very briefly in response to the comment and then we will move on. Perhaps he will be able to change the tone in his response.

[Peter MacKay, Progressive Conservative, Pictou—Antigonish—Guysborough, NS]

Mr. Speaker, I will answer the question. Yes, an individual abroad accused of doing something criminal in Canada could be prosecuted whether or not he or she was a diplomat in a foreign country. The problem would arise if a diplomat in a country like Denmark were accused of a crime there and chose to claim diplomatic immunity and come back to Canada. One cannot claim diplomatic immunity when out of the country serving as an ambassador.

As to who began down this road, I think the hon. member is suffering from some degree of memory loss. He should recall that it was an unprovoked question from himself that caused me to respond in kind.

Once again, only the Liberal Party benefits when we engage in this type of banter. I take no umbrage at all at the hon. member's comments. The member has no lessons to give this party or this member about what public statements were made and what complete turnarounds, somersaults and olympic backflips were done a short time later when Alliance members reversed themselves on all kinds of positions. The public record is clear on that.