Debates of May 9th, 2002

Government Contracts

[Bill Blaikie, NDP, Winnipeg—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Speaker, over the last few years leading up to 2000, Groupaction Marketing and Groupaction-Gosselin, between the two of them, contributed over $136,000 to the Liberal Party, not quite the rumoured 10% but almost 8.5%.

Does the minister himself not see the inappropriateness of the fact that these donations stand alongside the discoveries of the auditor general with respect to these contracts? I say to the minister, would he not consider a public inquiry? An RCMP inquiry has its place but it is secretive, it is not open, and we need the public--

[The Speaker]

The hon. Minister of Public Works and Government Services.

[Don Boudria, Liberal, Minister of Public Works and Government Services]

Mr. Speaker, on an RCMP inquiry, should there be one, that determination will be made by the RCMP. Of course, as was said yesterday and as I said and as I believe the Prime Minister said too, if anyone committed any harm, these people will be brought to justice.

[Bill Blaikie, NDP, Winnipeg—Transcona, MB]

Mr. Speaker, they say that smell is the strongest sense we have with respect to memory. I ask the minister himself: does he not remember when he and I experienced the same aroma that we have in the House today when the Mulroney government was in power? He did not like that smell then. He did not like the stench. What is he going to do about it now when it is on his own side?

[Don Boudria, Liberal, Minister of Public Works and Government Services]

Mr. Speaker, I say to the hon. member across, it is I who asked the Auditor General of Canada to do this report. It is I who tabled this report in the House of Commons. It is I who wanted transparency. It is I who wants to do these things right. With the support of members, hopefully on all sides of the House, that is what we are doing, that is what we will continue to do and we will strive to do even better.

[Joe Clark, Progressive Conservative, Calgary Centre, AB]

Mr. Speaker, does the government respect the independence of the auditor general?

Will it co-operate fully with her during her government-wide audit of advertising and sponsorship programs and contracts?

If necessary, will it ensure that the former minister of public works is called back so that he can testify?

[Don Boudria, Liberal, Minister of Public Works and Government Services]

In response to the first question—there were several—as to whether we will give the auditor general all the necessary co-operation, my answer is certainly, Mr. Speaker.

That is what we did for the first document. She said so herself yesterday, at a nationally televised press conference, and so on. That is how we have operated, and we intend to continue in the same vein.

[Joe Clark, Progressive Conservative, Calgary Centre, AB]

Mr. Speaker, let me ask whoever the acting Prime Minister is. On June 12, 1991, the Prime Minister said:

--when we form the government, every minister in the cabinet that I will be presiding over will have to take full responsibility for what is going on in his department. If there is any bungling in the department, nobody will be singled out. The minister will have to take the responsibility.

Does the Prime Minister's rule apply to Alfonso Gagliano?

[David Anderson, Liberal, Minister of the Environment]

Mr. Speaker, the words of the Prime Minister expressed at that time remain--

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.

[The Speaker]

Order, please. We have to be able to hear the response as well as the question. The hon. Minister of the Environment is trying to answer. We will want to hear this.

[David Anderson, Liberal, Victoria, BC]

Mr. Speaker, the words the Prime Minister expressed at the beginning of his government remain in force. We have exactly the same positions we had then.

I might point out to the right hon. gentleman, who was a member of the government previous to ours, that the reason we put in place such standards was because of the lack of them in the previous government.

[Gerry Ritz, Canadian Alliance, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

Mr. Speaker, the auditor general looked at a scant three contracts out of the thousands this past month and, surprise, surprise, all three were a blatant waste of taxpayers' dollars. According to the auditor general, the Liberal government consistently breaks the rules: business as usual.

Will the public works minister announce right now that all discretionary finances and advertising for these guys on the front row over there will be suspended today?

[Don Boudria, Liberal, Minister of Public Works and Government Services]

Mr. Speaker, I am not sure what he is referring to by so-called discretionary spending. All I can tell him is that the standing offer agreement that we had with the company in question was suspended. There were no further drawdowns from March 19.

Yesterday I announced that I was continuing that suspension, first, because the auditor general is continuing her work and, second, because she had referred the matter to the RCMP.

[Gerry Ritz, Canadian Alliance, Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK]

Thankfully, Mr. Speaker, the auditor general is going to dig a little deeper than the minister did in his own department.

The problem with these types of contracts is blatantly clear. A five point plan or a fifty point plan will not change the fact that $500 million has disappeared down this Liberal sinkhole in the last nine years. There is a pattern here.

How can Canadians even begin to trust the Liberal government to change the way it does business when it is clear that its idea of financial fundamentals is to line its own pockets?

[Don Boudria, Liberal, Minister of Public Works and Government Services]

Mr. Speaker, I will forget the ridiculous allegation made in the last part of the hon. member's question.

In the first part of it, when he alleges that the entire budget of sponsorship is a waste of money, which is what he just said, maybe he should turn around and ask all of his colleagues who send me letters of support, who ask me to fund different activities in his riding, including in his own city and in his own province and so on, whether they are advocating a waste of money the way he just accused his own colleagues of doing.

[Pierre Brien, Bloc, Témiscamingue, QC]

Mr. Speaker, now that the auditor general has uncovered the dubious practices of the Liberal administration, the government's strategy consists in having Liberal members discredit the auditor general, the very one whose work the minister of public works said not so long ago was of unimpeachable integrity.

Are we to understand that in order to save its hide, the government has been reduced to the oldest strategy in the book, that of blaming the messenger?

[Don Boudria, Liberal, Minister of Public Works and Government Services]

No, Mr. Speaker. In my opinion, the auditor general, an officer of this House, is acting in an entirely impartial manner.

[Pierre Brien, Bloc, Témiscamingue, QC]

Mr. Speaker, is the minister of public works going to call his colleagues, who are trying to discredit the auditor general, to order? Will he go after these members and tell them what he is telling us here, which is that she is doing an excellent job, that her work is irreproachable, and that what is going on is completely unacceptable? That is what we are asking.

Will he call to order the Liberal sheep who are busy discrediting the auditor general?

[Don Boudria, Liberal, Minister of Public Works and Government Services]

Mr. Speaker, to use the hon. member's words, I can confirm that in my opinion and in the opinion of the government, the auditor general's work is irreproachable. Those are his words. I agree.

[Monte Solberg, Canadian Alliance, Medicine Hat, AB]

Mr. Speaker, it is pretty clear what the government is trying to do. Questions about criminal behaviour are only the tip of the problem. Beneath that tip sits a mountain of corrupt, unethical behaviour directed by the most senior levels of the government.

Why does the government not admit that the only reason it is stonewalling a public inquiry is because it would expose that mountain of corruption that has become the foundation of this government?

[Don Boudria, Liberal, Minister of Public Works and Government Services]

Mr. Speaker, the auditor general yesterday reported on what she qualified as the conduct of two officials. Those are her words.

He refers to that as a so-called mountain. The hon. member should differentiate between what he calls a mountain and the actual size of the molehill.

[Monte Solberg, Canadian Alliance, Medicine Hat, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the reason the minister cannot see the corruption is the same reason that fish do not notice water: It is because it is the environment they live in.

The government might be comfortable with this culture of corruption, but Canadians are sick of this minister's arrogance. When will the minister admit that the reason for stonewalling the public inquiry is that it would expose this culture of corruption that is the premise of this government?

[Don Boudria, Liberal, Minister of Public Works and Government Services]

Mr. Speaker, in this case I think I will answer the preamble of the hon. member's question. I probably have most of the faults in the world, but I do not think that arrogance is one of them.

[Odina Desrochers, Bloc, Lotbinière—L'Érable, QC]

Mr. Speaker, because of the flagrant violation of treasury board rules in the Groupaction affair, the auditor general has broadened her investigation to include advertising and sponsorship contracts handed out by all departments.

Given the auditor general's scathing indictment, how can the government continue to claim that it is public servants who are responsible for this whole mess and that there is no political blame to be laid, when Liberal cronies have so richly benefited?