Debates of April 30th, 2003

Health

[Anne McLellan, Liberal, Edmonton West, AB]

Remember, Mr. Speaker, exactly what Dr. Brundtland said yesterday:

In the last week in the case of Toronto we have seen these changes: first of all, the magnitude of the probable SARS has decreased, it has been now 20 days since the last cases of community transmission, and there are no new confirmed export cases out of Toronto or Canada.

All of this took place under our existing procedures. However, if in fact confidence and reassurance can be provided by enhanced measures, then certainly we will move forward with those enhanced measures.

[Stephen Harper, Canadian Alliance, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, once again the minister fails to take responsibility.

We now know that the Ontario government thought the minister's approach was wrong. The WHO thought the minister's approach was the wrong way to go and told her repeatedly. The heritage minister thought it was the wrong way to go. The Canadian Alliance said in the House on March 27 that it was the wrong way to go.

If everybody in the world except this minister believes this was the wrong way to go and the minister will not admit this responsibility, how can Canadians have any faith in her ability to handle this kind of situation in the future?

[Anne McLellan, Liberal, Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, as I have said before and I have said in the House many times, in relation to a number of our procedures, including screening procedures, we reviewed the procedures in place on a daily basis. We assessed the risks and where necessary, based on the risk assessment from people on the ground, we enhanced the procedures.

However, in response to the leader of the official opposition's statement that nobody supported what we did, I can do no better than quote Dr. David Heymann who in April said:

Canada is doing an exemplary activity and much of what has been going on in Canada including the system--

[The Speaker]

The hon. member for Yellowhead.

[Rob Merrifield, Canadian Alliance, Yellowhead, AB]

Mr. Speaker, yesterday the WHO showed that airport screening measures have been inadequate and this minister knows it.

The WHO had called for proactive measures including interviews, but we still have not had a word from this minister as to what measures are going to be in place and when they will be there.

Will the health minister require interviews of outgoing passengers and exactly when will it take place?

[Anne McLellan, Liberal, Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, as I indicated, we will make a risk assessment on a daily basis, based on the advice of people on the ground. In fact, I informed Dr. Brundtland and we informed the WHO that we will be enhancing our screening procedures. We are doing this in relation to providing increased confidence and reassurance to the public, and to others.

I can reassure the hon. member, as I have said before, that we will be experimenting with a number of new technologies. We will put them in place as pilot projects and we will share what we learn with the rest of the world.

[Rob Merrifield, Canadian Alliance, Yellowhead, AB]

Mr. Speaker, that answer is very late and not very exact because we need to know when they are going to be in place and if they are.

The Ontario government has said that it has been asking the federal government for weeks to impose tighter screening measures at Pearson airport. The health minister's decision to refuse that request has cost Toronto over half a billion dollars. Why would the minister allow voluntary measures instead of mandatory measures in the first place?

[Anne McLellan, Liberal, Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, first of all I go back to the fact that we were one of the very first countries to act on the WHO recommendations. In fact, we consulted with the WHO throughout this entire process.

[Kevin Sorenson, Canadian Alliance, Crowfoot, AB]

No.

[Anne McLellan, Liberal, Edmonton West, AB]

Oh, yes, we did. Sorry.

In fact, on the basis of risk assessment we do on a daily basis we have advanced screening procedures both inbound and outbound. We remain one of the few countries in the world, as it relates to inbound passengers who on the planes--

Taxation

[Gilles Duceppe, Bloc, Laurier—Sainte-Marie, QC]

Mr. Speaker, according to Yves Séguin, the Quebec finance minister and author of a report that proved beyond all doubt the existence of fiscal imbalance, federal intervention in Quebec's jurisdictions is only possible “because of the resources available to the federal government, resources that are, moreover, more than it needs to look after its own areas of jurisdiction”.

Since the money is in Ottawa and the health care and education needs are in Quebec, what is keeping the federal government from moving out of the taxation space it does not belong in?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, this is something we have been debating for months. Each level of government has its area of jurisdiction for levying taxes.

Almost all of our tax fields are shared with the provincial governments. It is, therefore, not necessary to give them any taxation space. They already have it. Obviously our good administration is what has given us a surplus.

The hon. member, as a member of this House, ought to be congratulating the government because he is part of a Parliament that has succeeded in balancing its books, paying its debts, and having a surplus.

[Gilles Duceppe, Bloc, Laurier—Sainte-Marie, QC]

Mr. Speaker, what the Prime Minister is proposing is to raise taxes, which would be irresponsible both here and in Ottawa. The problem is that it is the same taxpayer doing the paying and being overtaxed by Ottawa.

The solution, and I hope the government will admit it, is for Ottawa to redistribute the tax base—not expand it—so that the provinces and Quebec can meet their health care and education needs, these not being areas under federal jurisdiction .

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, as far as taxation is concerned, everyone acknowledges that we have made transfer payments to the provinces for health care in the order of $34.8 billion over five years.

We have reduced taxes over five years by more than $100 billion, and have met our obligations. Despite all this, we have been fortunate enough to balance the budget and achieve a surplus. He ought to take the credit, along with all the rest of us.

[Pierre Paquette, Bloc, Joliette, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister knows perfectly well that the occasional cheque written by Ottawa does not correct the fiscal imbalance. What Quebec and the provinces want is for the federal government to mind its own business.

Is it so difficult to understand that in order to correct the fiscal imbalance, the federal government has to withdraw from tax fields to give Quebec and the provinces the fiscal resources needed to do their job and assume their responsibilities?

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, President of the Queen's Privy Council for Canada and Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, what we said during the Quebec election campaign was not just so many empty words. It was the only good response, because whether or not we think there is a fiscal imbalance, what matters is that governments help each other out.

For example, the Prime Minister of Canada made a commitment that if we ever ended up with a greater surplus than expected, an additional $2 billion would be given to the provinces for health care. That is the kind of help that will be possible in the sort of federation that we will be able to build with a government in Quebec that believes in Canada.

[Pierre Paquette, Bloc, Joliette, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister's proposal to increase taxes is irresponsible because, at the end of the day, it is the same taxpayer who has to pay. What is needed is a reallocation of the tax fields.

Will the Prime Minister acknowledge that if the federal government were to agree to this, tax increases would not be needed, and shifting this money from Ottawa to the provinces and to Quebec would enable them to provide the services they must to the public?

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, President of the Queen's Privy Council for Canada and Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, we have debated this issue time and time again. The member knows quite well that he would be hard pressed to find any other federal government in the world that has a smaller share of public revenues than the Canadian federal government. The share of the federal government's revenues compared to the Canadian economy is lower now than it was in 1949.

Which leads us to wonder, given the repetition of these same questions by the Bloc Quebecois, if it is not desperately trying to justify its existence.

Health

[Svend Robinson, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Prime Minister.

Yesterday the Prime Minister showed up in Toronto without a penny in disaster relief: nothing for small businesses, nothing for hospitality workers. He said it was because federal emergency laws do not cover diseases like SARS. That is not true. Section 4 of the Emergency Preparedness Act covers “emergencies of all types”.

Why did the Prime Minister misrepresent this law and why will he not now do the right thing and help Toronto businesses and hospitality workers who are hurting so badly from the SARS epidemic?

[Jean Chrétien, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, we have announced a series of measures to help the workers in that sector. It was announced by the Minister of Human Resources Development. We also have other programs.

I have discussed the question of giving compensation to the businesses with the premier. That is not something that is possible to do under the circumstances because there is no one dedicated tax for that purpose like the one that was reduced yesterday at the provincial level.

[Svend Robinson, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

Mr. Speaker, this has nothing to do with dedicated taxes. This has to do with the Emergency Preparedness Act and a crisis for Toronto businesses. The Prime Minister does not know what the hell he is talking about.

My supplementary is to the Prime Minister as well--

[The Speaker]

Order, please. I am not sure I heard the hon. member's language, but if I heard what I thought I heard, I was shocked. The hon. member will want to be very careful in his choice of language in phrasing his question in order to observe all the proprieties of the House.

[Svend Robinson, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

Well, Mr. Speaker, I will say that he does not know what he is talking about at all. My supplementary is to the Prime Minister as well.

First the government makes the problem worse and then it will not help those that are affected. A month ago Ontario asked for screening. The Minister of Health said no. A few weeks ago the World Health Organization asked. The Minister of Health said no. It is not Toronto--

[The Speaker]

The hon. Minister of Health.

[Anne McLellan, Liberal, Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, let me reiterate that in fact we were one of the very first nations to respond to the WHO recommendation in relation to screening. We worked with the WHO in relation to putting those procedures in place and we have done a daily risk assessment from people on the ground as to whether we needed to enhance those procedures.

Over the past six weeks we have added additional enhancements. We have put additional people on the ground: quarantine officers, nurses, doctors, and others at Pearson and Vancouver airports. As the risk indicated, we enhanced the procedures and at this--